Brothers (sisters, join the party too, pls!) - how do you handle if a sister (your wife, of course) 'lacks fire' sexually? Do you automatically conclude frigidity OR do you consider that she may be lacking the true fire - the fire of your love?
This is somewhat a rhetoric - random thoughts but do share your thoughts.
Sisters, if you've experienced emotional frigidity, you know that lack of true love could result in emotional frigidity which also causes physical coldness. Sad to say, our well degraded sex culture screams at us that everything is sexual but is that really so? Lets face it, for most women, the fire starts in the heart. Regardless of how the TV paints us, we are still emotional beings who love to be loved. Why do some brothers find it so hard to get that and neglect to lay the ground work all day long, but expect to come home to a hot fire?
Now, I am not advocating that wives be prostitutes - selling sex to your husband in exchange for favors, but common, brothers, there is no microwave fireplaces (at least not yet), so why expect microwave sexual readiness?
Am I way off here? Are there women out there that are �push button� digital sexual clocks or is my thought right that most women are analog watches that need to be wound?
No offence to either the digital (jet age, huh?) or analog ones amongst us. Just how I am expressing it, but y�all get my drift, do you?
KristianKidd - thank you for your comments but if I need a sermon I will go to church. Actually I am a preacher too sometimes but I don't feel the need to turn every discussion into a sermon. It just sounds very sanctimonious. I am not asking for advice here, I am responding to a thread based on personal experience. I'm not attempting to speak from anything other than my own experience, for what its worth. because I don't expect or need everybody to agree with me.
The Bible speaks to everything for us about life and godliness but it is not intended to explain everything. It will not tell you how to fix your car or program your computer. There are a lot of sound studies out there about psychology and I don't think it is wise to throw the baby out with the bathwater because the Bible is silent on many things.
Also, whatever my personal feelings are about the British culture, it is mine and I'm not going to justify it as accurate or not - just my experience and observation. I understand it to be general and that there are exceptions. I also understand it to be about the culture and not the people. I'm sure there are many wonderful British people. I just happen to not like their culture at all, especially with their obsession with Darwinism and their rather rigid approach to life. I have worked in British-owned companies and in the United Nations so I have been exposed to them a lot. Sorry, but I'm not a fan and even some Brits have told me the same thing!
Again, this is my personal opinion and I'm not claiming it to be anything other than that. Also, it is not really pertinent to this discussion. I understand that you live in the UK and I can understand you feeling insulted and I apologize but I wasn't speaking to you directly. Nevertheless, I hope you can be honest with the weaknesses of British culture just as I as an American can be with American culture. Lord only knows how many times I have heard negative stuff about America working in foreign companies. I don't take it personally.
Kristiankidd, You're right to stick to the word of God and that's fantastic. Just don't use the sword on your fellow soldier. You mentioned submission. I have some thoughts below.
I have a friend who put out a great article about submission. She helped me understand that it's not so much about doing everything he says. Nor is it slavery in any way. It can partly be described as getting up under him and helping him succeed. It's not doing everything the man tells you when he tells you. I am not a feminist. I know who I am in Christ. I know how He loves me and I know I should be treated well. I will not be made a slave to my husband. I will be his helpmate which is different. Nor do I think I have to follow his every inclination in every area. I don't think I have to do everything he says just because he says it. I certainly don't have to leave my spiritual life up to him. I would not put up with him treating me like a slave or telling me every move to make without a godly. I certainly wouldn't let him damage me. If he thinks that's submission, he can submit to the force of my fist in his face. Just kidding! But I really will not put up with it.
Ladies, remember two things about submission. You never have to submit to anything ungodly. You don't have to be made uncomfortable or do something that makes you uncomfortable or hurts you in any way. Your husband is to love you as Christ loves the church and as he loves his own body. He should not be making you feel uncomfortable or hurting you.
Ladies, also be kind to your husbands and give them due affection. Do not withhold from them as the Scripture says unless it's a period of prayer and fasting and come together at the end of that.
Hopefully I brought the conversation back around to where it was as you did kdhny. I think our lady Shunammite was just simply talking about a topic that she wanted to and that affects some. I am so sorry you had your experience with your wife kdhny. I pray that if you marry again God will bless you with a godly helpmate that will bless you every day of your life and truly minister to you. I am excited for that for you!
Just looking at the topic for what it is, frigidity is a harsh thing - male or female. God meant for men and women to be taken care of sexually in marriage. No one should have to live without it and I believe by faith we won't! And I think we should ask the Lord to help us never be that way and help us pick spouses that would never be that way.
Thank you so much for your kind and compassionate words GloryShine. God richly bless you! :angel:
Let me also make one thing perfectly clear here. I am very imperfect and I understand that I could have made many mistakes in my marriage. I don't want to make it sound like I am putting the entire onus of failure on her. In fact, my understanding is that when a marriage fails it is more because of the man than because of the woman. I was not walking strong in my faith at the time and this had a lot to do with it.
Intimacy is not an extra or add-on; it is the essence of a marriage. I am not speaking merely of intercourse here but the whole enchilada - the feelings of warmth, of togetherness, sharing, cuddling, etc. It is deliberate that we are told that the two will become "one flesh." It doesn't say they will become one mind or one heart but one flesh and this has double meaning because it becomes literally true through offspring.
About submission - I am not a fan of this word. It is just used too often by men to bludgeon women into - well - submission. I think we need to be very careful using the word when it comes to men-women relationships because ultimately we are to submit only to God (Jam 4:7) and I am not looking for a submissive wife but a loving wife.
So... u ready, kdhny11? I realize you are a wounded soldier, so I am ready for your return shots (wait, gimme a sec to pull on my bullet proof vest, k?).
Jokes apart though, sorry you had a bad "British experience" but if I were you, I wouldn�t generalize. Reading your post at a high level could indicate deep seated hurts resulting in generalization. I am first to admit that British people are not as warm as Americans. Hey, my first holiday back home to England after I came here, I stood out. I would be on the bus and in the American way I had learned, would smile at everyone, only to be greeted by stare downs! Everyone adores babies here, I smiled at babies in London and moms got scared of me. LOL! So, granted, you have a point. The way it comes across though, indicates an opportunity to let go. I challenge you, what if God brought the warmest most beautiful British woman into your life? You sound so closed up, you may not see the gift of God in front of you.
My family is British, I am not, but my family is one of the warmest I know (no bias). My dad and I kissed each other until I was in College and a roommate said �ewww� to it. I was embarrassed and never kissed him again. LOL! And there are many families like that in England. Please don�t be biased - For your own good. Generalizations can cheat us all of blessings. You have to let go your agenda to God. Remember, he gives the desires of our heart � but as a father, He tames those desires to His will. Simple logic � my daughter rarely asks for Soda or other undesirable things. Her desires are tamed to my discipline, and I give her the desires of her heart. Sometimes, I give her what she considers �undesirable� but as we spend time together in relationship, her desires are tamed to mine (under God, k? I am NOT bringing up a robot, pls!).
Disclaimer - All rights reserved! Sorry, I don�t have the patience to read the detailed long posts so I have only schemed through. LOL, I know mine are not the shortest either, so grace to you if you read mine in details! Anyways, that to say, I may be off here! However, no fear of being corrected ;-)
sweet sis gloryshine, you state "I don't understand frigidity at all. I can't imagine not having that aspect of your life looked after.", you assume marriages are always affectionate, but is that really so? I think lack of affection could quickly result in coldness. Not palatable for either parties and not right, but I think it happens. This is more real for people who have suffered some kind of abuse in marriage (verbal/Physical/emotional). Also VERY pronounced for people married to emotionally unavailable narcissist spouses. But in Christ, all can learn to love the right way. Hey, drinks doses of Song of Solomon and the frigidity should flee, no? SEX IS GODLY and GOD INTENDED to be ENJOYED!
kristiankidd , no offence but you've got the fire alright. Have you been married before to a frigid woman? If not, don�t quickly conclude that you would handle it bravely. It is God that works in us BOTH to WILL and to DO! You know, I have been a Christian since I was young and having gone through campus fellowship, I have learnt to pray for zealous brethren to keep the zeal. Please remember, it is God that works in us! GRACE! Period! I have seen too many become spiritually arrogant and fall. Unfortunately, the fallen giants are the most difficult to recover. It is great to have the zeal, God loves that, but please remember it is sola gratia. Grace Alone! May I challenge you to seek God in leading you as a teacher of His flock with a shepherd�s heart? You have a lot of content but do seek God on its use � to build. The world is waiting for people like you to build, not to tear down. You have a LOT to offer, dear brother! Use it for HIS glory!
I want to write more but now I am too tired - its been a long day. I am not frigid though! LOL. I promise y�all, if I had the right man by my side right now, affectionately all mine, in the right Godly arrangement (marriage), this tiredness will flee in the twinkle of an eye and I�d be ready for action ;-)
Thank you for your reply. Don't worry, your bullet-proof vest is more than gratuitious here. I'm just enjoying the discussion - not here for any war games. :angel:
I suppose I am wounded, but who isn't?
Now about the British thing. Oy vey! I'm regretting even mentioning it. My ex is actually not British but West Indian so the point was more about a British-style education than about British people.
Well sister you have actually admitted it - British culture is not as warm as American. That is really all I was saying and I have seen this firsthand and I am not the first to ever say it. I realize Hollywood is not an arbiter of reality but it is not entirely by accident that the British schoolmarm and arrogant British man are very common stereotypes (see Hell's Kitchen and Simon Cowell for an example). Just saying - that's a common perspective of us Americans and I realize it is not always true.
Look - I don't mean to be a basher here and that was not the point of my post at all. I think everyone can fairly see that.
I would love to be proven wrong though. So, if God sends me a lovely, spiritual British woman then cool! Not complaining. :rocknroll:
Also to the two people on this board that represent Britian - I can't help but notice that you two are both actually black. So, I just wonder if it is more of your African heritage rather than your British that is the warm side. Just a thought.
I agree with you that we should be extra careful to avoid generalizations but this does not mean that there are not valid tendencies.
I am a New Yorker and if I say that we New Yorkers tend to be more blunt and impatient - I would be perfectly correct because that is truly a tendency we have. We know that it doesn't apply in all cases because it is a tendency, not a trait. We can unlearn it but the culture/atmosphere is such that we are more likely to express bluntness and impatience than somebody from say Kansas.
I don't think there is anything wrong with pointing out tendencies. You yourself did this when you mentined about Brits not smiling as much as you are used to or being less amenable to kissing your father at a certain age. Doesn't mean it is bad - it is just a different tendency.
The point is not to take it personally but to laugh at it and enjoy our various quirks because we all have them. I really am not insulted if somebody points out that I am a Yankee and that I am a New Yorker and that means I am probably this or that. Well, it may be an exaggeration and a caricature but there is at least some truth to it. No harm done really.
