I, as one who was delivered from the devastating effects of alcohol 5.5 years ago, can't for the life of me understand how professing Christians can think this devilish concoction is ok for their consumption.
Their favourite passage from what I can tell is the one saying Jesus turned water into wine. NOWHERE does it say it was fermented, alcoholic wine. You have to make it say that you fit your theology.
In the Bible God warns against partaking of fermented wine.
Pr 20:1 Wine is a mocker, strong drink is raging: and whosoever is deceived thereby is not wise.
Isa 5:11, 22 Woe unto them that rise up early in the morning, that they may follow strong drink; that continue until night, till wine inflame them! Woe unto them that are mighty to drink wine, and men of strength to mingle strong drink
Isa 28:7 But they also have erred through wine, and through strong drink are out of the way; the priest and the prophet have erred through strong drink, they are swallowed up of wine, they are out of the way through strong drink; they err in vision, they stumble in judgment.
Pr 23:29-35 Who hath woe? who hath sorrow? who hath contentions? who hath babbling? who hath wounds without cause? who hath redness of eyes? They that tarry long at the wine; they that go to seek mixed wine. Look not thou upon the wine when it is red, when it giveth his colour in the cup, when it moveth itself aright. At the last it biteth like a serpent, and stingeth like an adder. Thine eyes shall behold strange women, and thine heart shall utter perverse things. Yea, thou shalt be as he that lieth down in the midst of the sea, or as he that lieth upon the top of a mast. They have stricken me, shalt thou say, and I was not sick; they have beaten me, and I felt it not: when shall I awake? I will seek it yet again.
God said not to even look at it when it's fermenting, much less drink it. It perverts your judgment.
You know what happened to Noah when he drank it. Not good.
You can be the most beautiful woman physically, but if you're down w/ drinking hooch, I find you unattractive and unappealing from that point on.
An people wonder why the u.s. is in the flusher. It's because the standards have been set to include the lowest common denominator. God's commands separation. God doesnt' have a big tent where everyone gets in. Christianity is the most exclusive, divisive religion in history.
If anyone disagrees, it's not w/ me but w/ the Book.
I would like to hear why drinking alcoholic beverages is ok for Christians.
I said your modern "bibles" have the devil being equal w/ Jesus. I'm positive you haven't looked up ANY of the info I've posted about the Alexandrian texts and Westcott and Hort.
Report me till your heart's content. If you don't have facts on your side you have to you'll have to resort to personal attacks. If you care to jump in the middle of a conversation and toss your hat in the ring, don't be surprised when it gets stepped on.
I want to be sure I don't misinterpret your position. Was Sinaiticus found in a monestary on Mt. Sinai and Vaticanus in the Vatican? And you're saying these 2 mss are perfectly fine to use as legit mss, correct?
ya know... sometimes the argument isn't worth the fight...
I've never seen in any version of the bible I've read where the devil is said to be equal to Jesus. As such I do not know what version you refer to. I have a bible contains several versions side by side and while some of the word choicing is slightly different the underlying meaning isn't any different.
If you think AA is a Christian attempt to heal drinkers, then you confirmed my suspicion about the sad state american Christianity is in. AA teaches serve any "god" that you prefer.
the church is heading forward to a time of apostacy & rank heresy. Where have you been? Lu 18:7-8 And shall not God avenge his own elect, which cry day and night unto him, though he bear long with them? I tell you that he will avenge them speedily. Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth?
One of the greatest signs of the last days Jesus spoke about is a departing of true faith by the Christian Church. Never has that been more apparent than today. Whether it is President President Obama butchering Christian theology, George W. Bush worshipping in a Japanese Shinto shrine and hosting Islamic services in the White House, Billy Graham saying that Jews, Muslims, and pagans without a knowledge of Christ can still go to heaven, head of Trinity Broadcasting Network Paul Crouch saying that we are little gods, or the Pope kissing the Koran, and welcoming all religions as one, apostasy is rampant within the Church. This apostasy filters all the way down to even small churches. Leaders and teachers are a necessary part of the Church but when they consistently depart from the Word of God and refuse to repent of their error then they are no longer worthy of trust. Plus the fact that many of them are involved with homosexuality and adultery. 2Co 11:13-15 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.
Jesus had harsh words of denunciation for the religious hypocrites of his day with their traditions and outward piety. It is no different today. Most of the Church leadership and membership are just playing Church. They have turned Christianity into churchianity. Rightly did Isaiah prophesy of these hypocrites.
OM Precious GOD !!!..What the Heck is goin on in here ??? Alot of Sh'Ot Slingin bout people drinkin...not drinkin...right...wrong...
:rolleyes:....Geweeezzz....Some peoples children are just so Full of ThemSelves...Better to be Drunk in the WORD together..:buddies:...than Drunk...:toomuch:...in Self Rightiousness...:winksmile:...xo
This will be my last post on the Bible issue, since this was not intended to be about that but about the sinfulness of drinking alcohol.
When speaking of the N.T., of the over 5000 total continuous-text manuscripts, 98% or more contain a basically Byzantine Textform (the Majority Text or Textus Receptus.) These are the basis of the N.T. in the KJB. The N.T. of the modern "bibles" come from the alexandrian texts (the critical texts), the main mss being Codex sinaiticus and vaticanus. Alexandria, Egypt was rife at this time w/ the gnostic belief system which made its way into the CT. I've already told you where these were found (catholic monastery and vatican) & that should concern you right there.
CT (Critical Texts) proponents readily admit the Byzantine text-type is predominate in the manuscript evidence. Even a flyer distributed by the publishers of the NASB (a CT based version) states in reference to the TR, "... 95% of the known Greek NT manuscripts of the Greek NT are closer to these than to the Greek text behind most modern English translations." Dr. James Logsdon, a member of the NASB translation committee, completely renounced the NASB once he realized what terrible mistakes were in the Alexandrian MSS.
I'm going to give a few heresies found within the modern perversions.
John 1:18 No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him. (KJV)
No one has ever seen God; the only Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, he has made him known. (RSV)
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. (KJV)
For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. (RSV)
For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. (NIV)
These here say God has only one Son. That's not true. He has only one BEGOTTEN Son. Only on unique, special Son being Jesus Christ. We must all become the sons and daughters of God to get to heaven. Rom 8:15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father. John 1:12-13 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. Gal 3:26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
1Jn 3:1-2 Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.
Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.
The perversions diminish the uniqueness of Christ.
Mt 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. (KJV)
And he said unto him, Why askest thou me concerning that which is good? One there is who is good: but if thou wouldest enter into life, keep the commandments. (ASV)
"Why do you ask me about what is good?" Jesus replied. "There is only One who is good. If you want to enter life, obey the commandments." (NIV)
Who is the only one that's good? You wouldn't know by reading the perversions.
Lu 4:4 And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God. (KJV)
And Jesus answered unto him, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone. (ASV)
Jesus answered, "It is written: 'Man does not live on bread alone.'(NIV)
Do you see what's happening?
Mt 20:23 And he saith unto them, Ye shall drink indeed of my cup, and be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with: but to sit on my right hand, and on my left, is not mine to give, but it shall be given to them for whom it is prepared of my Father. (KJV)
He said to them, "You will drink my cup, but to sit at my right hand and at my left is not mine to grant, but it is for those for whom it has been prepared by my Father." (RSV)
Jesus said to them, "You will indeed drink from my cup, but to sit at my right or left is not for me to grant. These places belong to those for whom they have been prepared by my Father." (NIV)
Many modern "bibles" completely leave out Mark 16:9-20. VERRY interesting.
Removing the Divinity of Christ:
Isa 7:14 Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel. (KJV)
Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign. Behold, a young woman shall conceive and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel. (RSV)
You should realize there's a difference between a woman and a virgin.
Rev 1:11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea. (KJV)
saying, What thou seest, write in a book and send it to the seven churches: unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamum, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea. (ASV)
saying, "Write what you see in a book and send it to the seven churches, to Ephesus and to Smyrna and to Pergamum and to Thyatira and to Sardis and to Philadelphia and to Laodicea." (RSV)
which said: "Write on a scroll what you see and send it to the seven churches: to Ephesus, Smyrna, Pergamum, Thyatira, Sardis, Philadelphia and Laodicea." (NIV)
Is Jesus the first and last or not?
The devil twisted the word to Eve in the Garden and asked, "Yea, hath God said?" Gen 3:1
He also said he'd be like the most High. Isa 14:14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. (KJV)
He did it in the modern perversions.
Isa 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! (KJV)
"How you are fallen from heaven, O Day Star, son of Dawn! How you are cut down to the ground, you who laid the nations low! (RSV)
How art thou fallen from heaven, O day-star, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, that didst lay low the nations! (ASV)
Who is the day star? Why, it's Jesus, not lucifer. 2Pet 1:19 We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts. (KJV)
How you have fallen from heaven,
O morning star, son of the dawn!
You have been cast down to the earth,
you who once laid low the nations! (NIV)
Who is the morning star? Why, it's Jesus, not lucifer. Rev 2:26-28 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations: And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father. And I will give him the morning star. (KJV)
Re 22:16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.
Lucifer is same as Jesus in the modern perversions, like he said he would be, yet modern Christianity either doesn't notice this or just doesn't care.
You may have been ignorant to this info before, but you're not now. This is just the tip of the iceberg what I've given here.
You will be held responsible for the decision you make regarding this issue.
