So, I was in the chat room and someone commented that a person who IM'd them stated they smoked pot. The commentor stated she immediately said goodbye and closed the chat window. I thought the topic was interesting and tried to ask a question, but apparently I offended someone by bringing up the topic.
First let me state, I AM NOT ADVOCATING MARIJUANA USE. I have never done an illegal drug in my life.
For me this is a thought experiment. I am interested in how we come to the views that we do.
With that said, on what basis do you say marijuana use is wrong? Please provide an argument for why it is wrong. Off hand I can not think of a verse that prohibits it.
If it is becuase it is against the law in the US, would it be different with medical marijuana like here in Colorado, or where it is completely legal like in Holland?
If it is wrong because it is mind altering, then how is it different than having a glass of wine or two after work or in the evening while at home?
Do you view it wrong if it is for medical use to allieviate chronic pain? If not, how would that be different than taking vicodin or any kind of narcotic pain killer?
If it is because it is potentially addicting, then what about anything else that is addicting? by that I mean anything that people become to focused on, like playing XBOX, or fixing cars or anything else that becomes an obbession with someone?
If it is becuase it is "bad" for you, then what about anything else that people consume that is bad for you like sugar, caffine, fat, etc?
Again, this is a thought experiement. I like to understand the views we have and possible contradictions.
Good point. However, I�d like to point out two things: The prescription drugs that you mentioned are all used to treat cases of an already fragile mental state. Vicodin is used to treat unbearable pain, Valium is used to treat panic attacks, and anti-anxiety meds are used to treat the daily stress called by someone with an irrational thought process. In all three cases you mentioned, the drugs are therapeutically used to return a person to a normal level of mental stability (pain-killers, for the most part, work by blocking the brain�s ability to recognize pain). The purpose of the recreational use of weed is to escape a normal level of mental stability.
Also, when used correctly, these drugs should not cause altered perception (meaning chemically impaired judgment by my dictionary). There is a �correct� way to use marijuana, and it comes in a pill form, Marinol, and it�s used to treat nasea, vomiting, and loss of appetite in cancer and AIDS patients. According to my nursing drug book, an altered mental status is an indication of too strong of a dose. When used properly, Marijuana drug products should not alter perception at all.
I think what this brings us down to is that it isn�t necessarily the drug itself that is �bad�. The abuse of the drug is what causes us to attach a negative stigma to it.
Great, now we have to define �drug abuse,� right? Ugh. My head hurts. Someone else do it, ok?
You say people who use pot recreationally are seeking some sort of an escape or altered state of mind. But you say that prescribed meds do not have that effect. Without going into the variety of these drugs, perhaps you can tell me why many pain meds have a warning not to drive or use heavy equipment, etc, when taking the medications because the cause drowsiness and impairment. I would say that drugs like Hydrocodone, Oxycontin, Flexeril, and Morphine, to name a few are pain meds or muscle relaxers that have much worse mind altering effects than pot does. And yet pot has the ability to ease pain and allow a person to sleep without waking up hung over like opiate derivitive drugs do.
No matter what the food and drug people say, it is more likely they are interested in lining their pockets than in protecting us from bad things like the evils of pot. If they can create it and make it they'll find a way to force it down our throats. If we find something on our own that is more beneficial than their inventions they have to make it illegal in order to keep their profit machine going. That is the real reason pot is illegal.
They have tried to do the same thing with an herb called Chapparel that has amazing cancer curing abilities and has been used for centuries by Native Americans to treat and cure cancer.
Altered States...Its been told to me...that these types of Drugs are for people that cant handle Reality...they want anything to change the way they Feel...Flip side...Reality is People who cant handle Drugs...IE dont need / want to change the way they Feel...even when it hurts...I found that interesting...xo
Yes, this plant should be legal to grow in its drug and industrial forms. There are many unknown plants that have drug components in them that are legal, and yet they haven't been made illegal.
From what I've read it borders on conspiracy why its illegal, which involves such industries like cotton, oil, and timber. It was vital to make people scared of and start smear campaign against the negative consequences of marijuana, so they could in fact shut the door on one of the most useful crops in the world, industrial hemp.
I think its fine if a person or they know a person that grows it and utilizes the drug. The problem is though, alot of people buy the drug, not knowing its source. Marijuana sounds like the main drug feeding the drug cartel wars in Mexico, killing thousands. So its illegality has hurt people far worse than if it was legal.
Munchies is when a stoner has been to lazy to eat for a while because they were busy getting stoned. They eat anything to hand because they are too lazy to get any real food when they realise they are hungry.
Almost all resin is a waste of time as it is poor quality and will just burn the throat.
Quality, pure weed is actually like drinking a fine wine, and a couple of tokes can have a large effect.
Depending on the type you have will change the effects.
It can be a laugh once in a blue moon but there's always the idiots that take it too far and move onto harder things.
Stoners tend to be pretty boring people on the whole and I don't get involved as I have better things to do with my time.
New York City Diesel and LA Confidential are my favourites, but only good growers will have things like that and the price will be about 4 times that of the cheap rubbish.
If I was going to have any again it would have to be quality and not about getting stoned.
Regular smoking causes tolerance, and damages the lungs so as a habit it is a complete waste of time. Unless you have a medical condition etc.
With all drugs there is a certain balance pharmacists try to acheive - they want to provide the most effective treatment with the least dire side effects. The aim of narcotics is not to effect a person's mental status; however, those side effects do occur if the dosage is too high. When everyone's body reacts differently to a certain drug, it is especially difficult to find that balance. This is why drug labels warn about the possibility of impaired mental effects.
I'm not knocking people who use marijuana medically; I'm sure it works great for relieving pain. The problem is that with smoking pot the difference between "therapy" and "stoned" can be as little as half a hit off a joint. I just think its hard to regulate how much is an acceptable use for therapy when you can buy bags of it with a card.
It's like people who use cold medicine to get high. Sure its OTC, and there are recommended doses on the bottle, but if you knowingly take more than is required for a therapeutic effect, you're just abusing the drug. I feel its the same for people who smoke "medical" marijuana. If you can take the recommended dose and achieve the desired therapeutic effect without getting high, good for you. But if you get stoned off of your medicine, then you're just abusing the drug.
@Marcus:
"Munchies is when a stoner has been to lazy to eat for a while because they were busy getting stoned. They eat anything to hand because they are too lazy to get any real food when they realise they are hungry."
Well that's not at all judgemental. Thank you for that little gem of wisdom.
Hey Yall...I heard the news this morn that 3 men methodicly robbed a Marijuana Health Clinic at Gun point...Guess the ole sayin " Pot leads to " Other Drugs " could be true here...The Drug of Violance...There is a first time for everything...:rolleyes:...
These are Very Dark Times we are livin in there is no question of that...Its jus brings ta memory the Words of our Lord Christ Jesus... " If you LOVE Me...You Will Keep My Commandments"...Guess some people jus dont LOVE Him like some people do...........................xo
I'm surprised to see a thread like this here. Brother Shawn - for showing bravery against one of the more taboo subjects out there I applaud you!
I've heard maybe one horror story involving marijuana and it was about someone who turned to a harder street drug (mushrooms?) and wrecked his car - it cost him his life and he was about 22 years old at the time. At 22.. you're just starting the journey of life.
In regards to alcohol.. because of that sorcery/drug, I've had to witness my mom getting thrown down a flight of stairs, be beat up, and watch my dad get arrested when I was 6 years old. Yes, alcohol is a poison to the body in that the brain reacts severely to it. Enough of it in the blood can kill a person. If you've seen some of the commercials I have, life's a huge pool party with scantily-clad women and cold brew in hand if you choose beer.
Common use results of this drug are headaches, bad decision making, fornication, drunk driving and subsequent vehicular homicide, and the list could go on. It can easily become an idol if one needs it daily to live life and worship God. A long time ago I heard a sermon of which *anything* needed to worship God is an idol whether it be a strong drink, a puff, a pill, or rosary beads.The only thing one really needs to worship God is an open, receptive, sincere heart.
In regards to pharmacology - medicines, legalized narcotics like opiate-based medicaments; a few here already gave the truth on it. Most medicines out there that are prescribed by a doctor have some sort of side effect. To me that means it's either an instant poison to the body like alcohol, or it's more unGodly sorcery from the depths below. I'm still hunting for the verse number for this, but the bible does say that all the knowledge of man will come from below - more than likely because truth doesn't sell very well, it's stranger than fiction, and these days Christians are being subverted at the same rate that secular humanists are - quickly through the public school system. It was Bertrand Russel, one of the co-founders of predicate calculus who stated publicly that the public school system was the "cure" to Christianity. Coincidently today with modern health professionals, an open relationship where the communication flows is encouraged rather than shunned. That's exactly what Christianity is.. a relationship.. not a series of rituals nor traditions there to chain people down. Christ came into this world to set people free, redeem us of all of our sins, and be a Savior to this world.
Anyone ever hear of Chantix... the prescription drug that kills its users? Nicotine is another poison to the body that has taken the lives of 4 people I once knew. For me personally.. I love the taste of coffee but can't have it regularly or I won't eat enough food. A doctors work is called practice, not miracle cure. Guess who is the guinea pig? You are, and it's by choice.
Pharmakeutos is a Greek word that means druggist, person who creates potions/poisons, or sorcery which is a form of divination (the bad kind of divination that involves cutting up the dead to "learn" and that's called necromancy.) The early symbols of this practice once called an apothecary had an image of a serpent circling a stave but that has been removed to keep it from appearing evil. Why are there side effects to begin with where a medicine may help one part of your body but destroys another? Most likely more dirty chemistry and it goes well beyond the pharmaceutical industry to the foods we can buy at the store which are also chemically engineered. A chemically engineered America are we.
Side effects for dirty chemistry can be anything from impaired driving ( a muscle relaxer that worked for me made me too impaired to keep driving 35 mins to work !), disorientation, even death. The sad thing is when you're filling out the questionnaire to see a doctor they try to find any issues you might have that are related to something else, possibly heredity related.. to take the blame off of pharmaceutical industries of which many doctors invest stock. That makes sense to some out there.. prescribe a medicine that you have stock in as long as the patient's insurance will cover it?
From what I understand, the Office of National Drug Control Policy/ONDCP is *required* by law to lie (deceive) about cannabis. Here is an article showing the law itself and explaining that it's more about money and politics than any possible harm from the seed-producing plant itself:
President Jimmy Carter smoked it and stated that laws shouldn't be harsher than the drug in question is itself. The reason it's illegal is that people wouldn't need pharmakeutos anymore and that's a lot less revenue, a lot less insurance, and a lot less hassle. With the love of money comes the disregard of human life. Most of the new medicine commercials out there that flood a television aren't going to advertise that they'll wreck your liver in 5 years, or your heart in 10. When you take any pill, you're becoming part of a long running experiment.
Ladies and Gents, my brothers and sisters in the Lord.. I'm not advocating marijuana use specifically here but sometimes I really would like a choice on exactly how I "relax responsibly". Would it be with a burning drink that makes my head hurt, also a known depressant? (Try to find the number of alcohol-related suicides in this country - it's a ghost you strangely cannot find!) Smoking anything that is burning is not good for your lungs, and altering the thinking greatly does not fly well with God. People are still going to do what they do though.
There is the argument of a seed-yielding tree, God said "Let it be for meat." Let it be for consumption, wholeness, sustenance. Sad thing is that many of the dangerous hard drugs like crack/opium come from a seed too. Early on in the 1900 - 1915 AD range they used actual cocaine in medicines. This was also around the time that people still played with radioactive elements and their hands started glowing green. They really didn't know.
I'm not sure why anyone would want to induce hallucinations, or not enjoy reality the way God intended.. with simple child-like faith! However, between alcohol and marijuana I've witnessed a ton of destruction with alcohol as it seems to create anger, and I've met some of the most friendly people ever who smoked cannabis. Whoever stated it was a good all-natural anti-depressant and less damaging than anti-depressants in another thread was probably right.
Since its prohibition, cannabis has had a misinformation campaign that exists to deceive people about it and keep them in fear. You can even check out a good movie about its history narrated by Woody Harrelson to be more informed. When something is portrayed by the media as evil and harmful, yet millions of people around the world believe different because they're speaking from personal experience rather than indoctrination.. chances are the wool is being pulled over someones eyes. It's been used for thousands of years to ease a number of problems in more open-minded cultures.
Anyway... too much of anything is an idol, don't poison your temple.. the gift that God gave you! Faith in God is by far better than faith in mans sorceries. From what I understand.. in Europe it isn't legal there either but simply overlooked in the Netherlands where they have little to no crime there. It's not because everything is legal there, it's because they don't have all of the prohibition there about telling you what is right and wrong and trying to beat that misinformation into your head and those cafe shops probably keep people balanced with an all-natural solution. From what I know and understand, not one single person has ever died from marijuana use. You cannot overdose on it, and you can also eat it for the same effects. The synthetic form called Marinol is said to be unpredictable - one man suffering from chemo-therapy said he was stuck on the couch for two days and couldn't move from the fake (synthetic) concoction. Side effects of marijuana include creativity, intellectual discussion, laughter, creating appetite but also include reduced motivation in certain people. I think it was Brazil that was running tests on the natural plant as an anti-psychotic medicament - the results of which I never discovered.
The only thing I would say here to advise another is that be very careful with any medications that the doctor may give you. In scripture, 100% of the time, unclean spirits were the cause of all illness and dis-ease. They are called daivmwn in the Greek, and the word is demons, meaning 'knowing ones'. This part of the bible more than likely will not be accepted as truth by any med student out there.. but all of God's word to us is true, not just the parts that tickle our ears. Using sorcery that comes from below to "treat" unclean spirits that come from below is probably why my uncle died from lung cancer and radioactive treatment rather than the love, mercy, and grace that comes from above.
Here are some useful hints or clues to let you know you're probably dealing with witchcraft or sorcery as there is some superstition involved with it:
Without this medicine, this condition "might" happen.
Without this medicine, this condition "could" happen.
Without this, this condition "may" occur.
If you walk under that ladder..
If a black cat crosses your path...
When you see "might", "could" or any other words that are there to instantly create a little bit of doubt in your head.. it's probably superstition. A seed of doubt is what messed things up in the Garden of Eden.
Truth isn't a relativistic blur that cannot be determined or based upon guesswork; it's an absolute constant that tears through deceit much as a beam of light through darkness.
Does anyone remember the Hippocratic Oath doctors were once required to have to practice ethically? It's been abandoned by almost all the colleges out there and it used to be mandatory.
If it puts on a white coat, and puts on an act of caring because that is what was advertised.. chances are that you just bought something or subscribed to something. Some people just feel smart knowing a lot of 4 and 5 syllable words and their head swells. My KJV refers to Luke as a physician, but in those days only certain people were allowed to practice divination (the good kind of divination has schools out there as well) and in this case my heart easily can discern that Luke was a 'trained one' rather than a sorcerer when he was defined as a physician.
Even if marijuana does typically ease a good number of physical problems, makes you relax, rids you of a migraine, etc.. constantly doing something that will damage the lungs in your temple is just no good at all because we still need to breathe. If you're going to use it for either recreation or pain, try to find a safer way than directly smoking it.
There are only two kinds of people out there when it comes to marijuana, those who speak from indoctrination and those who speak from experience. One or both may have a hidden agenda.. so just trust God fully over man and the fallen world's info which comes from below.
In 2010, most foods you buy in the supermarket for daily consumption should be considered pharmaceuticals. Is a chemically engineered America a healthy America? Or is it one rather that is getting cold in heart, and loving death? People are already rooting on the reality defying, life-stealing hero in most Hollywood films. With video games today, this younger generation believes that the more blood and gore, the better. It's just more sickness that our culture has and an indication of what is to come. When you remove God from the equation because of law.. guess what happens.. your land gets cursed. When you go out and shed blood, expect it to be likewise in your own land (The daily news will show you some horrors out there.)
If you're Christian, and reading this.. it really is okay to ask your doctor if he/she believes in Jesus and ask them how they came to know Him. If they don't know Jesus, find one who does. There are doctors out there who do know what marijuana does and how harmless it can be when used properly. Honestly, I don't feel it is for everyone out there but that same belief holds true for the rest of the pills out there to address many different types of issues. One medicine may work for one person but not another. Something else you may find interesting.. my brother-in-law is a Police Officer and he can't wait to retire so he can enjoy "toking up" again. He's not Christian, but rather Catholic and he's a straight-edged cop who knows the difference between dangerous and outright deceptive.
If you are struggling with drug addiction, pray. Throw out the idols or put them all at the foot of the cross. Jesus knows what to do with it.
For anyone who might read this tonight or tomorrow.. Merry Christmas and may God bless you richly and in whole, amen. Take some time to talk to someone who is mad at you.. and tell them you're sorry to make amends. Visit a retirement home and see who may not have heard the "good news" of Jesus Christ. The clear message I get from scripture is to be the washer of anothers feet, not debate and fuss with thy neighbor about personal disagreements.
Give of your heart selflessly year round, not just on Dec. 25th.Our Lord and Savior was born, and for that I rejoice!
Thank you Jesus .. for redemption and your abundant love you've shown me over the years. The love portrayed on tv as fornication doesn't come close to what you have, Lord!
I can speak from experience when I say violence is not a side effect of pot. If anything it has just the opposite effect. Alcohol on the other hand can and does cause violence. And from my Hippie days observing both pot and alcohol use it is hard to imagine why alcohol is legal and pot is illegal. So it must be political. In other words pot cannot be patented for big profit like beer & wine. It is the love of money that is the root of this evil. It is evil to torture people by denying use of a plant God created for good use. " Their fruit, will be for food, and their leaves for meicine,"(Ez47:12).
Rev.22:2 "And the leaves of the tree are for the healing of the nations."
i loved how everyone discussed this intellegently!!! it grows really well in the south, and i have often thought regulating pot, and helping southern farmers to grow it for medical/research use could help the south financialy. however, doctors, pharmacists would have to be careful! as i told a pot-smoking friend: (medical pot doesn't mean you get to roll a joint for a hangnail!)
