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Author Thread: It's Time to Get Serious People
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It's Time to Get Serious People
Posted : 13 Dec, 2010 05:27 PM

I love you, so I'm going to tell you some hard truth, as it is written "Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him. (Leviticus 19:17, KJV)"



My profile was getting crowded with much of this, so I'm putting it here instead for those who are truly seeking, who are really searching for G-d's Will. I don't know everything. Far from it. But this I do know: Most professing Christians are not going to make it. Sadly.



As I'm entering this, one of the random women suggestions above, which CDfF.com has delivered, is a picture not of a woman, but of a black square instead, which contains the words "ONLY GOD CAN JUDGE ME". How appropriate. Indeed, this is the prevailing attitude of this wicked generation, who thinks they can live however they like without incurring His Judgment. Most of us will not hear the Truth. The sad fact is that GOD WILL JUDGE YOU if you refuse to repent of your sin. You are supposed to work out your salvation with FEAR and TREMBLING (Philippians 2:12).



Personally, I'm not looking for a Christian woman, at least not what is common among 'Christianity'. I'm looking for a follower of G-d's Messiah, whose priority is truly following Him rather than men; following Christ Jesus by the Spirit of Christ and in accordance with what is written... not a denomination, not a pastor, not the latest teaching, nor your feelings, nor your friends, and certainly not the majority of professing Christians. Christianity is plagued with traditions of men that nullify the commandment of G-d, which Christ Jesus HATES (See Mark 7:7-9). "But he answered and said, Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up. (Matthew 15:13, KJV)" To have a hope, we must give Him our lives, and if you've given Him your life, it's no longer yours to do with as you please. It's His.



Most people I come across who profess to be Christians are not really following Christ Jesus. To someone who is really in Messiah, it is very obvious. When you truly step out of the world, it is shocking to see how a part of the world the overwhelming majority of professing Christians are in the world; integral. Unfortunately, though not surprisingly, most professing Christians don't even realize they are not actually following Christ, but the sad truth of the matter is that most professing Christians follow man, and, sadly, are headed straight for destruction as a result. It very well could be that you are just such a person, even likely, so let this be a warning to you if you hear His voice as you read this. The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom (Proverbs 9:10).



The Master says, "Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity (ANOMIA; LAWLESSNESS!). (Matthew 7:21-23, KJV)" Not all believers are "saved," despite what man will tell you. As James says, "Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? (James 2:19-20, KJV)"



"Then said one unto him, Lord, are there few that be saved? And he said unto them, Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. When once the master of the house is risen up, and hath shut to the door, and ye begin to stand without, and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open unto us; and he shall answer and say unto you, I know you not whence ye are: Then shall ye begin to say, We have eaten and drunk in thy presence, and thou hast taught in our streets. But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all [ye] workers of ANOMIA. There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you [yourselves] thrust out. (Luke 13:23-28, KJV)"



The Master says, "If any will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow ME. For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: but whosoever will lose his life for my sake, the same shall save it. (Luke 9:23-24, KJV)" If you really follow him, frankly, you will hardly fit in anywhere. As He says, "Because ANOMIA will abound, the love of many will wax cold. (Matthew 24:12)" "My sheep respond to my voice, and I know who they are. (John 10:27, KJV)" If your goal is to fit in with most Christians and have a nice cozy life --- if your goal is to fit in at the average church --- sorry, you're not really following the Master. It's time to wake up people.



So what's the difference between the real believer and the imposter? We should be in the world, not of the world, set apart by His Spirit, WHOLLY OBEDIENT TO HIS COMMANDMENT. We do not pick and choose which commandments to obey. The soul that abides in sin shall die (Ezekiel 18:20). Unfortunately, most Christians fail to understand what, precisely, sin is. Sin is transgression of the Law (1 John 3:4), as given to Israel by G-d through His humble servant Moses. And it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before G-d, but the doers of the Law will be justified (Romans 2:13). Being Jewish doesn't matter, nor being Gentile; what matters is that you become a new creation in Messiah, who keeps the commandment of G-d (Galatians 6:15, 1 Corinthians 7:19)! The LORD changes not!



Fellowship and worship on the first day of the week if you like, but don't reject the G-d-given 7th day Sabbath, nor His feasts, and stop eating what is not food, stop celebrating pagan festivals. Wives, be reconciled to your husbands or remain alone. Stop believing the lie that G-d's grace means it's okay to sin, or that you cannot sin in Messiah even though you do! Don't be absurd. This passage in John's epistle means you are not in Messiah if you abide in sin! If you are truly in Messiah, you cannot abide sin just as HE CANNOT ABIDE SIN! He who says he abides in Messiah and lives in sin is a liar and the truth is not in him (1 John 2:4)! Don't be deceived. Unless you repent, you will perish (Luke 13:3,5).



Some follow Rome, some follow Luther, some John Calvin... some THINK they follow Paul, but 'Is Christ divided?' as Paul so aptly said (1 Corinthians 1:10-15). Blessed are they, rather, who hear the Word of God and obey (Luke 11:28). Traditions are unacceptable if they nullify the Law of God in any way. THAT is the test. As He said: I have not come to destroy the Law. Whoever breaks one of the least of these instructions will be called least in the Kingdom of Heaven, and unless your righteousness in these matters exceeds that of the scribes and the Pharisees, you certainly will not enter the Kingdom of Heaven (Matthew 5:17-20)! But hey, believe what you will. As for me and my house, we will serve the LORD (Joshua 24:15).



So let's love Him every day with all our hearts, souls, minds, resources, and love our neighbours as ourselves. Interestingly, those two instructions are not found in the Ten Commandments, but elsewhere in the Law; in Deuteronomy and in Leviticus respectively! That fact should speak volumes to you about the accuracy of the common understanding of the words of Jesus ('We must keep the Ten Commandments...'). It's true, but not the way most people mean to say. As it is written, 'The commandment is a lamp and the law is light, and reproofs of instruction are the way of life. (Prov. 6:23)' Do you have one without the other? Or have you not then turned the lamp off??!



So what did Jesus mean when he said the most important commandment of all is 'HEAR O Israel' (Mk. 12). Most professing Christians prefer to quote this occurrence as it appears in Matthew, which leaves this critical demand out. Most, I find, tend to say '...as long as I love God and love my neighbour, it's all good, even if I choose not to live entirely by the Word,' but WHAT IS LOVE? How do we know whether or not we love? The word translated in Mark 12 as HEAR (SHEMA, see Deut. 6, which means HEAR/LISTEN/OBEY) is the key to love. As John says, 'the love of God is that we keep His commandment, and his commandment are not grievous. (1 John 5:3)' And likewise, 'By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and obey his commandment. (1 John 5:2)'



How do we know, then, that a husband loves his wife, and a wife her husband? What about their children? A son his parents? Parents their children? Hopefully you guessed it hopefully... So don't forget SHEMA! When we SHEMA to the best of our ability, we THEREFORE love God and love our neighbour; and you can then know, therefore, that you will love your husband or wife as yourself. If this sounds insane to you, then you haven't yet really met Jesus. Search for him. Search for him with all your heart and you will find him.



And stop following men! Follow Jesus! Meditate on the Scriptures, seeking the illumination that only the Word of G-d can provide by His Spirit, and act on it! Stop paying heed to your frivolous feelings, attributed to the Holy Spirit, that are not consistent with Scripture ('I feel like the Spirit is telling me it is okay to not obey this time...'). The heart is deceitful above all and desparately wicked (Jeremiah 17:9). Test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world (1 John 4:1).



Feel free to message me if you have any questions. G-d willing, He will give me the wisdom to respond appropriately. But please, the above is Scripture. If you don't agree, take it up with Jesus.





P.S. To the divorced on here, I'm curious what you think:



How do you interpret the words of Jesus? ...maybe no one has brought your attention to these words before:



In Luke 16:18 and Matthew 5:32 (see also Mark 10:10), Jesus is recorded as saying he who marries a woman divorced from her husband commits adultery. (ESV)



Likewise, in 1 Corinthians 7:11, Jesus says through the Apostle Paul "To the married I give this charge (not I, but the Lord): the wife should not separate from her husband (but if she does, she should remain unmarried or else be reconciled to her husband), and the husband should not divorce his wife."



Just prior to that, Paul writes the following:



"Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral....will inherit the kingdom of God." (1 Corinthians 6:9-10)



I'm just doing the math here. It seems pretty logical to me, but maybe I'm missing something... The LORD says marrying a divorced woman is committing adultery, which is sexual immorality, and Paul warns us that the sexually immoral will not inherit the kingdom of God.



Are you quite sure you want to remarry?



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It's Time to Get Serious People
Posted : 14 Dec, 2010 03:57 PM

Question if your are from the living, or those that are in Christ, why do you fellowship among the dead so much?



2 Corinthians 3:6 (King James Version)



Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.



Corinthians 3:6 (Young's Literal Translation)



who also made us sufficient [to be] ministrants of a new covenant, not of letter, but of spirit; for the letter doth kill, and the spirit doth make alive.



4-6We couldn't be more sure of ourselves in this�that you, written by Christ himself for God, are our letter of recommendation. We wouldn't think of writing this kind of letter about ourselves. Only God can write such a letter. His letter authorizes us to help carry out this new plan of action. The plan wasn't written out with ink on paper, with pages and pages of legal footnotes, killing your spirit. It's written with Spirit on spirit, his life on our lives!



2 Corinthians 3:6 (New American Standard Bible)



6who also made us adequate as (A)servants of a (B)new covenant, not of (C)the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but (D)the Spirit gives life.



I believe the New Covenant is a covenant that came forth out of the love of God, and that is the Spirit behind it.



The letter says no divorce but if you look hard enough, you will find exceptions, but I guess you believe divorce is the impardonable sin!!



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It's Time to Get Serious People
Posted : 14 Dec, 2010 04:39 PM

Hey Lawabider,



Do you have a relative or brother named "propheticcalling?"



Godly divorce exists~



Abraham divorced Hagar as requested by Sara.



and about God divorcing Israel~cited from online scriptures:



Anyway, TS did not misquote that, God divorced her for her unfaithfulness~"Surely, as a wife treacherously departs from her husband, so have you dealt treacherously with Me, O house of Israel," says the Lord. (Jeremiah 3:20)



Thus says the Lord: "Where is the certificate of your mother's divorce, whom I have put away? Or which of My creditors is it to whom I have sold you? For your iniquities you have sold yourselves, and for your transgressions your mother has been put away." (Isaiah 50:1)



Then I saw that for all the causes for which backsliding Israel had committed adultery, I had put her away and given her a certificate of divorce; yet her treacherous sister Judah did not fear, but went and played the harlot also. (Jeremiah 3:8)



Hosea 2:16 "In that day," declares the LORD, "you will call me 'my husband'; you will no longer call me 'my master. ' 17 I will remove the names of the Baals from her lips; no longer will their names be invoked. 18 In that day I will make a covenant for them with the beasts of the field and the birds of the air and the creatures that move along the ground. Bow and sword and battle I will abolish from the land, so that all may lie down in safety. 19 I will betroth you to me forever; I will betroth you in righteousness and justice, in love and compassion. 20 I will betroth you in faithfulness, and you will acknowledge the LORD







We all have been through shtuff and are drawn to truth, grace and mercy. Of the 102 names found for Jesus, here's a few~ Yeshua, Emmanuel, Yah, Comforter, Alpha and Omega, Friend of sinners, High Priest, Guide, Gate for the sheep, I Am, Jehovah, King of Kings and Lord of Lords, all indicate He fulfilled all of the moral, civil and ceremonial laws and wrote the law of love in our hearts. We must remain moral, but there is nothing indicating we have to keep the "C" laws.



There is one lawgiver, who is able to save and to destroy: who art thou that judgest another?





Shalom to you~



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It's Time to Get Serious People
Posted : 14 Dec, 2010 05:23 PM

@twosparrows:



Truly, your challenge isn't with me.



Paul's not talking about G-d's Law in Galatians. Think about this for a moment. Do you really think Paul wrote Galatians to justify the Protestant Reformation, 1,500 years later?



Paul was responding to the challenge to the Gospel of his day:



"And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, [and said], Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved. (Acts 15:1, KJV)"



As we have already discussed, Circumcision was used in Paul's day to refer to (a) being Jewish, (b) being part of the covenant community of G-d, and (c) ritual conversion to Judaism. The word translated above as MANNER is the Greek word ETHOS, which refers to CUSTOMS, I.e. the Oral Law.



The challenge to the Gospel in Paul's day was by SOME of the Circumcision, not all, who said that only Jews have a part in the World to Come, as many unbelieving Jews will still tell you today. 'Jesus is great and all, but Gentiles must convert to Judaism (BE CIRCUMCISED) to be saved.'



I know what you're thinking, and bless you for not trying to call down curses on me, but you're mistaken. I am not cursed for preaching another Gospel. The OTHER Gospel that Paul is referring to, which is no Good News at all, is that you have to convert to Judaism to be saved. Why is it no other Gospel at all? It's impossible in the first place, just as an elephant can't become a tiger, and even if it were possible, it would make the promise that the nations are blessed in Abraham of no effect.



The clues are all over Galatians. Be very careful reading Paul.



"For do I now persuade men, or God? or do I seek to please men? for if I yet pleased men, I should not be the servant of Christ. (Galatians 1:10, KJV)"



"For ye have heard of my conversation in time past in the Jews' religion, how that beyond measure I persecuted the church of God, and wasted it: And profited in the Jews' religion above many my equals in mine own nation, being more exceedingly zealous of the TRADITIONS of my fathers. (Galatians 1:13-14, KJV)"



"But neither Titus, who was with me, being a Greek, was compelled to be circumcised: (Galatians 2:3, KJV)"



Notice how Paul is using Circumcision and Uncircumcision in Galatians 2. Look! Jew and Gentile.



"But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed. For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision. And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation. (Galatians 2:11-13, KJV)"



Do you see what's going on here? Jews mixing with Gentiles, together as one. This was not a problem for Peter after the vision G-d gave him in Acts 10, from which he concluded, "I perceive that God is no respecter of persons: But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him. (Acts 10:34-35, KJV)" G-d had even given Peter a vision about not calling any man common or unclean (v.28), yet for fear of the Jews, he was separating himself from the Gentile brothers in Christ, which lead others into this hypocrisy with him, even Barnabas. This is why Paul withstood him. THIS is what Paul is addressing here that is not in accordance with the truth of the Gospel.



"I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain. (Galatians 2:21, KJV)"



This should raise a red flag and give us pause. Does righteousness not come from the law? Remember? Paul says in Romans 8:4: "That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. (KJV)"



And this is consistent with the Holy Scriptures, which says of the Law (Genesis through Deuteronomy), "And it shall be our righteousness, if we observe to do all these commandments before the LORD our God, as he hath commanded us. (Deuteronomy 6:25, KJV)"



So what is Paul saying? If righteousness comes from the law of the Jews that says that all Jews are saved, and one merely needs to convert to being a Jew, THEN Christ would have died for nothing. There would have been no need. But that is not how man is saved.



**WARNING: Paul uses the Greek word translated as law (nomos) to refer to different things at different times.**



"O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you...This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? (Galatians 3:1-2, KJV)"



Did you receive the Spirit by faith or by ritually converting to Judaism?



"Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh? (Galatians 3:3, KJV)"



"For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit. For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. (Romans 8:5-7, KJV)"



What is it to be spiritually minded if to be carnally minded, which includes not being subject to the law of G-d, is death?



Flesh = death

Flesh = opposed to G-d's Law

Spirit = life and peace

Spirit =



"That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith. Brethren, I speak after the manner of men; Though it be but a man's covenant, yet if it be confirmed, no man disannulleth, or addeth thereto. (Galatians 3:14-15, KJV)"



Do you see? The Gospel includes the Gentiles. Do you see how hard Paul is working to help Gentiles understand? You don't have to be a Jew to have a part in the World to Come! But by faith in Christ Jesus, you who were once far off are brought near; grafted into one body in Christ. And how does Christ walk? He is wholly obedient to the Law of G-d. And so he who abides in Him does not reject the Law of G-d either.



"But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe. But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.

Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. (Galatians 3:22-24, KJV)"



"But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage? (Galatians 4:9, KJV)"



Is Paul calling the Law of G-d weak and beggarly elements? How can you know? G-d prepares us for this ahead of time:



"If there arise among you a prophet, or a dreamer of dreams, and giveth thee a sign or a wonder, And the sign or the wonder come to pass, whereof he spake unto thee, saying, Let us go after other gods, which thou hast not known, and let us serve them; Thou shalt not hearken unto the words of that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams: for the LORD your God proveth you, to know whether ye love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul. Ye shall walk after the LORD your God, and fear him, and keep his commandments, and obey his voice, and ye shall serve him, and cleave unto him. And that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams, shall be put to death; because he hath spoken to turn you away from the LORD your God, which brought you out of the land of Egypt, and redeemed you out of the house of bondage, to thrust thee out of the way which the LORD thy God commanded thee to walk in. So shalt thou put the evil away from the midst of thee. (Deuteronomy 13:1-5, KJV)"



If you can't help but twist Paul's words, then you should throw out his writings altogether according to G-d's previous instruction, for Paul would not be sent by the G-d of Israel, and if not from the G-d of Israel, from no G-d at all. But, if you throw out the writings of Jesus' Apostle to the Gentiles, what hope will you have? Jews will tell you must convert to Judaism in order to have a part in the World to Come, which by the way demands that, in addition to G-d's Law, you also fully embrace the Oral Law. As Paul says, this would be as falling from grace:



"Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the WHOLE law. Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace. (Galatians 5:2-4, KJV)"



And if Paul is not talking about ritual conversion to Judaism here, but the physical act of circumcision, then because of Paul, Timothy was is in big trouble (See Acts 16:3).



"And I, brethren, if I yet preach circumcision, why do I yet suffer persecution? then is the offence of the cross ceased. (Galatians 5:11, KJV)"



"For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature. (Galatians 6:15, KJV)"



What is the new creature in Christ? How do you recognize him? As Paul says in 1 Corinthians 7:19:



"Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God. (KJV)"



As the Master says, "Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven. (Matthew 5:17-20)"



Grace and peace to you in Christ Jesus.



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It's Time to Get Serious People
Posted : 14 Dec, 2010 05:31 PM

@PhillipJohn:



I don't believe divorce is the unpardonable sin. I did not say, nor mean, that there are no exceptions. I am simply asking you to consider your course carefully. "Are you sure...?"



If your case does not apply, praise G-d.



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It's Time to Get Serious People
Posted : 14 Dec, 2010 05:48 PM

@joeysings:



No relative or brother named "propheticcalling".



And I did not say TS misquoted, I said he "missed the historical context and even the context of the place in Jeremiah where your one verse quote appears..."



He is talking about G-d having cast off Israel in the present tense, which Paul rejects. And if that were not clear for 2,000 years, it should be abundantly clear today.



And the Law says nothing about "ceremonial laws", anywhere. Where does this idea come from? Men, so that they may reject whole sections of the indivisible commandment of G-d because G-d forbid someone might think they are Jewish!



The root of anti-nomianism has been anti-semitism from the beginning. It is no different today. Yet if you would enter life, keep the commandment.

DontHitThatMark

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It's Time to Get Serious People
Posted : 14 Dec, 2010 05:53 PM

I think we are to keep the whole 10 commandment law, but the ceremonial law/sacrificial law was done away with. The governing law of Israel is not applied to anyone anymore. We no longer have to build a parapet around the roof of our house, we no longer have to observe feast days, and we no longer have to sacrifice a lamb for our sin. Those laws were done away with at the cross. The 10 commandment law is the law of love, and that is the only one we have to keep, in my opinion. The 10 commandments are a guidebook to show us how to love God and our fellow man. The "laws of Moses"/etc was a witness against a faithless Israel, and it was not applied to the new covenant. Whenever the apostles talk about the law of Moses(ceremonial/sacrificial/governance), they say it is done away with and we don't have to worry about it. Whenever they talk about the 10 commandments they say that it is necessary and that we should keep those commandments to show love to God and our fellow man and to avoid sin. There is a clear separation between the two in their dialog. God made a clear separation when He wrote the 10 commandments with His own finger in stone and commanded them to be placed inside the ark of the covenant. Moses scribed the "ceremonial/sacrificial/governance" on paper as dictated by God, and placed the "laws" outside the ark.



Acts 15:1 And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved. 2When therefore Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and disputation with them, they determined that Paul and Barnabas, and certain other of them, should go up to Jerusalem unto the apostles and elders about this question. 3And being brought on their way by the church, they passed through Phenice and Samaria, declaring the conversion of the Gentiles: and they caused great joy unto all the brethren. 4And when they were come to Jerusalem, they were received of the church, and of the apostles and elders, and they declared all things that God had done with them. 5But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses. 6And the apostles and elders came together for to consider of this matter. 7And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe. 8And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us; 9And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith. 10Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear? 11But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.



12Then all the multitude kept silence, and gave audience to Barnabas and Paul, declaring what miracles and wonders God had wrought among the Gentiles by them.



13And after they had held their peace, James answered, saying, Men and brethren, hearken unto me: 14Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name. 15And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,



16After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:



17That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.



18Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world. 19Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God: 20But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood. 21For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.



22Then pleased it the apostles and elders, with the whole church, to send chosen men of their own company to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas; namely, Judas surnamed Barsabas, and Silas, chief men among the brethren: 23And they wrote letters by them after this manner; The apostles and elders and brethren send greeting unto the brethren which are of the Gentiles in Antioch and Syria and Cilicia: 24Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment: 25It seemed good unto us, being assembled with one accord, to send chosen men unto you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul, 26Men that have hazarded their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ. 27We have sent therefore Judas and Silas, who shall also tell you the same things by mouth. 28For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things; 29That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.





:peace::peace:



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It's Time to Get Serious People
Posted : 14 Dec, 2010 06:51 PM

@DontHitThatMark:



Let's slow down for a moment here and think about this...



You say you must only keep the 10 commandments, right? So do you keep the Sabbath day holy? Any of the Sabbath days? Oh yeah, right, the feasts of the LORD are given in the Law... fine.



So you quote Acts 15 at length, but you clearly haven't considered the implications and how that affects your perspective about the 10 commandments:



"20But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood. 21For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day."



So which is it? The 10 commandments or the four above? The 10 + 4? And what does verse 21 above mean? That Moses had his shot and we're doing something new now?



Great, so lying is okay now, as is homosexuality, beating your servants/employees, rape, incest... and repentance is no longer necessary either...



But hold on, the four instructions listed above (abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood) are straight out of LEVITICUS... hmm...



But additionally, Paul also says that drunkards and practicing homosexuals will not enter the Kingdom of Heaven, oh and neither will liars or cowards... wow, these guys were just making it up as they were going, right?



No, we have misunderstood because our foundation is rotten. All of these things are straight out of G-d's Law, and the 10 Commandments are categories of instruction, which are illuminated in the rest of the Law.



As David said, "Thy word is a lamp unto my feet and a light unto my path. (Psalm 119:105)"



His son, Solomon, explained, "For the commandment [is] a lamp; and the law [is] light; and reproofs of instruction [are] the way of life: (Proverbs 6:23, KJV"



You don't have one without the other. If you don't have the instruction in the Law, it is because you have turned the commandment ("The 10") OFF.



And as Solomon warns, "He that turneth away his ear from hearing the law, even his prayer [shall be] abomination. (Proverbs 6:23, KJV)"



So what does Acts 15 really mean? Verse one is talking about ritual conversion to Judaism (I would encourage you to review my last couple of posts addressed to TwoSparrows), which men were saying was required in order for you to be saved.



The key is verse 19. The KJV renders it "Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God:". Past tense, but the Greek word EPISTREPHO, which is being translated there, is actually a present tense verb which means TURNING.



This Council at Jerusalem established the first steps for Gentiles who were TURNING to G-d, so that Gentiles could join the assembly in synagogues and learn what is instructed in G-d's Law.



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It's Time to Get Serious People
Posted : 14 Dec, 2010 07:06 PM

I'm with joeysings - as my former husband committed adultery, I am released from that marriage. Moses and Paul make it clear that remarriage=adultery only if the divorce was only for a reason other than adultery.



I am glad for you, Law-Abiding Citizen, that your father is now a follower of Christ. If my former husband comes to that saving knowledge as well, I shall reconsider. But for now, I will not be reconciled to that man.



Yet I know that I am free to marry again, to experience a Godly marriage, to grow in my relationship with Christ in that manner as well. And I do want this - for myself, for my children, and for my (as yet future) husband.



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It's Time to Get Serious People
Posted : 14 Dec, 2010 07:08 PM

Gah! Not sure how it posted before I "told" it to, but anyway. . .



As of yet, God has not brought a husband (or potential husband) into my life. I do not know if He ever will; He may not, and I have peace with that.



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It's Time to Get Serious People
Posted : 14 Dec, 2010 07:38 PM

Don't answered it quite well, but it's obvious that you came here to build your pulpit and case. This seems to be a pit stop for some people bent on preaching incessantly to those who have chosen a path of grace and have peace about it. Of course it's easier to pick a website forum to do this, because in person, you would be rebuked by the mature followers of God and asked to leave if you continue to "push" this stuff on the pilgrims traveling a road less traveled and needing encouragement and a cup of cool water.



You are preaching "another gospel" and that can be more than one thing. I started in the Spirit and choose to continue in the Spirit, because we already found out NO one but Jesus could abide by the old schoolmaster and set us free from it.



Go on with your heavy burdens and sterile offer of an intimate God that I know (by grace) and has carried me through every flood, fire and hell, back to His throne of grace for 38 years. How refreshing and welcoming when this journey becomes wearisome. :purpleangel: Selah~thank you, Yeshua my best friend and lover of my soul, who whispers to my spirit, "pay this matter of the law no mind~I paid a high price and fulfilled it once and for all."



"Come unto me all yea that are heavy laden and I will give you rest." ~Jesus~

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