Thread: Spirit of Man : Literally Dead or Figuratively Dead?
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Spirit of Man : Literally Dead or Figuratively Dead?
Posted : 8 Apr, 2011 05:08 AM
There are some brothers among us who interpret the Bible in light of their Doctrine. They would have you believe Ephesians 2:1 ("...you were dead in your transgressions and sins, in which you used to live....") means the spirit of man is literally dead, (though it is hard to imagine how a person could live without a spirit).
I feel the word dead is meant figuratively, meaning the spirit of man without the help of the Holy Spirit is dead to spiritual things and ultimately condemned to death.
But don't take my word for it or let preconceived doctrine determine what the word 'dead' means in relation to mans spirit.
Rather let's let the Bible show us how to interpret the word 'dead' in the Ephesians verse :
Isaiah 57:16 " I will not accuse forever, nor will I always be angry, for then the spirit of man would grow faint before me....."
Ecclesiastes 3:21 "Who knows if the spirit of man rises upward....?"
1Corinthians 2:11 "For who among men knows" the thoughts of a man except the man's spirit within him?
So in light of what the Bible has to say on the spirit of man, what do you think, is the spirit of man literally dead or figuratively dead?
Spirit of Man : Literally Dead or Figuratively Dead?
Posted : 8 Apr, 2011 08:43 AM
Two -
I feel the word dead is meant figuratively, meaning the spirit of man WITHOUT THE HELP OF THE HOLY SPIRIT is dead to spiritual things and ultimately condemned to death.
Ryan - And this is what we have continuously said. Do they give themselves the Holy Spirit? You say they need His help, then you say they give themselves the Spirit.
Spirit of Man : Literally Dead or Figuratively Dead?
Posted : 8 Apr, 2011 09:14 AM
Ryan, no that is not what you are saying. You have been saying a person must be born again, regenerate, to even consider accepting Jesus, because as you put it they are literally spiritually dead.
Spirit of Man : Literally Dead or Figuratively Dead?
Posted : 8 Apr, 2011 09:24 AM
2sparrow, this is the zillion times this has been explained, so what is the problem as to understanding what the Lord is saying in Ephesians chapter 2, and throughout His word.
All one must do is READ Ephesians chapter 2, the complete chapter to understand what Paul is saying, instead of just reading the first verse.
Also its good to have READ Romans chapter 6, Romans chapter 7, and Romans chapter 8. Then there will be clear understanding as to what Ephesians chapter 2 is speaking about, its so very simple, but if you're not READING then you will never understand with spiritual insight as to the meaning of being spiritually dead, and how when you become a Christian that God quickened (made alive) and changed your sinful nature.
Question: "What is spiritual death?"
Answer: Death is separation. A physical death is the separation of the soul from the body. Spiritual death, which is of greater significance, is the separation of the soul from God. In Genesis 2:17, God tells Adam that in the day he eats of the forbidden fruit he will �surely die.� Adam does fall, but his physical death does not occur immediately; God must have had another type of death in mind�spiritual death. This separation from God is exactly what we see in Genesis 3:8. When Adam and Eve heard the voice of the Lord, they �hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God.� The fellowship had been broken. They were spiritually dead.
When Jesus was hanging on the cross, He paid the price for us by dying on our behalf. Even though He is God, He still had to suffer to agony of a temporary separation from the Father due to the sin of world He was carrying on the cross. After three hours of supernatural darkness, He cried, �My God, My God, why hast Thou forsaken Me?� (Mark 15:33-34). This spiritual separation from the Father was the result of the Son�s taking our sins upon Himself. That�s the impact of sin. Sin is the exact opposite of God and God had to turn away from His own Son at that point in time.
A man without Christ is spiritually dead. Paul describes it as �being alienated from the life of God� in Ephesians 4:18. (To be separated from life is the same as being dead.) The natural man, like Adam hiding in the garden, is isolated from God. When we are born again, the spiritual death is reversed. Before salvation, we are dead (spiritually), but Jesus gives us life. �And you He made alive (quickened us), who were dead in trespasses and sins,� (Ephesians 2:1 NKJV). �When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your sinful nature, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins� (Colossians 2:13).
To illustrate, think of Jesus� raising of Lazarus in John 11. The physically dead Lazarus could do nothing for himself. He was unresponsive to all stimuli, oblivious to all life around him, beyond all help or hope�except for the help of Christ who is �the Resurrection and the Life� (John 11:25). At Christ�s call, Lazarus was filled with life, and he responded accordingly. In the same way, we were spiritually dead, unable to save ourselves, powerless to perceive the life of God�until Jesus called us to Himself. He �quickened� us; �not because of righteous things we had done, but because of his mercy� (Titus 3:5).
The book of Revelation speaks of a �second death,� which is a final (and eternal) separation from God. Only those who have never experienced new life in Christ will partake of the second death (Revelation 2:11; 20:6, 14; 21:8).
Check out this site for scriptural answers www.gotquestions.org
Spirit of Man : Literally Dead or Figuratively Dead?
Posted : 8 Apr, 2011 09:31 AM
Spiritual death is simply the lord no longer in man's spirit.
The bible does not ever say or imply that in separation from the father, man can not respond to God.
The absence of light creates darkness, or the absence of the father in man's spirit made it dark, but the father had a answer for that.
It is often said the Holy Spirit had to help men but the Holy Spirit was not man's helper until after the resurrection.
The Holy Spirit did come upon the priests and king's and prophet's for the office they where given, but that was not for everyday living.
The father's solution was the word of God.
Isa 55:11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.
Ps 119:105 NUN. Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.
Ps 119:130 The entrance of thy words giveth light; it giveth understanding unto the simple.
Job 32:8 But there is a spirit in man: and the inspiration of the Almighty giveth them understanding.
ob 33:4 The Spirit of God hath made me, and the breath of the Almighty hath given me life.
Pr 20:27 � The spirit of man is the candle of the LORD, searching all the inward parts of the belly.
Joh 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
The word of God is Spirit and life, faith cometh by hearing and hearing by the word of God, as men of old heard and obeyed the word they heard they walked with "God as did all the old testament saints.
Ga 3:6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.
Ga 3:7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham.
Ga 3:8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.
The word The word the word the word the word.
Man is born again by the word of God that is how the lord does is with man first the word, then the spirit comes in and creates a new spirit in man.
The holy spirit always performs the word of God believed by man even in spiritual death.
Spirit of Man : Literally Dead or Figuratively Dead?
Posted : 8 Apr, 2011 01:47 PM
2sparrow, Thanks you for acknowledging my brillance in God's word... but sorry to inform you it doesn't take brillance to understand what God means about being "spiritually dead" before salvation.
It only takes READING the word, and knowing the importance of why STUDYING to show yourself approved to God a workman who need not be ashomed, when rightly dividing the word of truth, brings spiritual understanding in order that you might "get it", and not lean to your own carnal understanding. Only then will you and all others who "have not got it yet , will be illuminated by the Holy Spirit of God to know that BEFORE salvation you were spiritually dead, separated from God, without any spiritual knowledge, spiritual understadning, orspiritual wisdom of, and in the things of God.
If only one would even READ the complete chapter 2, one would come into the spiritual knowledge of this...
Spirit of Man : Literally Dead or Figuratively Dead?
Posted : 8 Apr, 2011 04:06 PM
ET, not only are you brilliant, but also hilarious! Two diametrically opposed posts on the same thread from you in the same day, you are quite the enigma.
