‎"How you view God determines the quality and style of your Christian experience. Many Christians spend much of their lives paralyzed because, although they have trusted Christ as Saviour, they have never really seen what His sacrifice teaches us about the character of God. He gave His Son; He sent His Son; He �handed over� His Son because He loves us.
He does not love us if we love Him. He loves us with an unconditional love; therefore, we should love Him. The message of the covenant is one of God�s totally free grace to His people. Of course, it calls for a response of total commitment. But notice the order: God�s covenant love is not the result of our commitment; it is the cause of it. The pattern is, �I will, therefore you should;� not �I will, but only if you will first.�
If we have deep-seated fears that God does not really love us (as many Christians have), we can only go so far in growing nearer to God. There will come a point at which we will fear to trust Him any further because we cannot be sure of His love. When we look at ourselves, or our own faith, or our circumstances we will never be free from those lurking fears. Satan will see to that. But when we lift up our eyes and look on the cross we find the final persuasion that God is gracious towards us. How can he be against us when all His wrath against us fell upon Christ? How can He fail to care for us when He gave the only Son He had for our sake? How can we doubt Him when He has given us evidence of His love sufficient to banish all doubts?"
Great Message James! To bad unconditional election and limited atonement pretty much emasculates such a Great Message. If only the offer was for all, only if Christ died for all, then Satan could not whisper into ears, "You're not elect, Christ didn't die for you" It turns Good News into nice news, kinda like maybe you lotto ticket is a winner--- maybe you've been choosen to be elect!
(I never really realized what a different Gospel you preach)
Great Message James! To bad unconditional election and limited atonement pretty much emasculates such a Great Message.
James replies:
You are wrong. The great message you just read was written by a Reformed theologian. Read it again, and realize a Calvinist WROTE it.
Twosparrows continues:
If only the offer was for all, only if Christ died for all, then Satan could not whisper into ears, "You're not elect, Christ didn't die for you" It turns Good News into nice news, kinda like maybe you lotto ticket is a winner--- maybe you've been choosen to be elect!
(I never really realized what a different Gospel you preach)
James replies:
Your scenario is a fantasy. You are Arminian, and you PRETEND you even understand what it is like to be a Calvinist.
First off, since over half of Arminians today believe you can lose your salvation, they believe to KEEP being saved, they have to WORK at it, or else God does NOT love them anymore.
Notice this line from the article:
"The pattern is, �I will, therefore you should;� not �I will, but only if you will first.�
I will but only IF you will FIRST, is Arminianism!
Arminians believe that Jesus death did not actually save ANYONE, but IF you will FIRST believe, THEN it will apply to you.
And I guess I must remind you again that there is no such thing as a lost person who WANTS to be saved!
You act like their are people out there who are not saved, but they WANT to be, they just can't because God won't let them.
You see, if you reject what the Bible teaches about fallen mankind, then yes, I guess to you it looks like their ARE people out there who would want God to save them.
But the Bible says the OPPOSITE. Paul says that NO ONE seeks for God, and that fallen mankind actually SUPPRESSES the knowledge of God.
You said:
", kinda like maybe you lotto ticket is a winner--- maybe you've been choosen to be elect!
Your scenario is a fantasy. You are Arminian, and you PRETEND you even understand what it is like to be a Calvinist. First off, since over half of Arminians today believe you can lose your salvation, they believe to KEEP being saved, they have to WORK at it, or else God does NOT love them anymore.
twosparrows replies :
No, James I am not Arminian, Jesus died for me while I was a Sinner, I Love Him because He Loved me first. Jesus died for the Sin of the Whole World, there is nothing I can add or take away from that, therefore there is nothing else to do but Rest in His finished work.
James:
Notice this line from the article: "The pattern is, �I will, therefore you should;� not �I will, but only if you will first.� I will but only IF you will FIRST, is Arminianism! Arminians believe that Jesus death did not actually save ANYONE, but IF you will FIRST believe, THEN it will apply to you.
Twosparrows replies:
I don't think Arminians believe that, not being one myself I wouldn't really know. I do know the pattern is "I (God) already have, you choose"
James :
And I guess I must remind you again that there is no such thing as a lost person who WANTS to be saved!
James wrote - "Arminians believe that Jesus death did not actually save ANYONE, but IF you will FIRST believe, THEN it will apply to you."
Yeah... whatever... :rolleyes:
James wrote - "And I guess I must remind you again that there is no such thing as a lost person who WANTS to be saved!"
Nah.... those who sought to know Jesus did so because they had nothing better to do.
The keeper of the prison where Paul and Silas were held asked them... "Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house."
Its amazing that with an act as incredible as the creator of the universe stepping out of paradise and into a lost world to be tortured and murdered at the hands of his own fallen creation,and people still want to take credit for their own salvation.Just amazing!
I once was lost but now am found....lets see when your lost can you find yourself?
was blind but now i see....Oh,I know,I performed an operation on myself and now I see???
And who are you little clay pots any way to question why the lord picked some and not others
Steve only the calvinist can't see, you see believers, believe the word of god, and see what is written just like Jesus said to.
What Calvijnist teach about getting a new heart and then believing is witchcraft.
It is not about you being right, but about the word of God is truth.
Calvinist just make a big scene trying to say those that agree with the word of God and respond to it are saving themselves, and no one believes that.
You see Steve they know that total depravity and total inability are not bible teachings, but simply the doctrines of men.
You should give yourself a month sometime and seek the lord and refuse to hear any calvinist opinion's, if you are sincere in seeking the truth, he will deliver you from the unbelief, and you will be free and full of joy.
I would not want to walk into the presence of the lord full of calvin
