This might be a little lengthy,yet I believe this is worth reading;
The Early Church
by Darrel Meeks
Did You Know? The early Christians, strange as it may seem:
Never built "church" buildings and sanctuaries!
[They met in homes or other public places available to them. Corporate property controlled by a man, or group of men, was never a consideration.]
Never called a physical building a church!
[This is a ludicrous practice for those walking in the Spirit]
Never incorporated with the state!
[Special tax status and business structure are the exact opposite to their thinking since we are called to be separate from the worldliness all around us, and to be a peculiar people (different) in relation to the rest of society.]
Never perpetuated denominational names (distinctions based upon doctrinal differences)!
[This does nothing but create division in the hearts of people, although there is only one true church regardless of man's attempts at distinctions.]
Never had a central headquarters on earth!
[Paul was an itinerant church planter. Although the church in Jerusalem was deemed to be an authority on final doctrinal issues, it was not to be that way for very long since Jerusalem was destroyed in 70 AD. Also, the assumption that Rome became the second center of control stands upon no facts whatsoever. It is pure heresy to assume such.]
Never maintained human membership roles!
[The Lord placed true believers in His church, not men. He knows His sheep and His sheep know his voice.]
Never built or conducted seminaries!
[It was the Gospel of Jesus Christ that was conveyed to the world, thus there was no need for any worldly educational institution of any kind. Other teachings by the apostles were the result of addressing the almost limitless questions and problems we mortals are capable of instigating.]
Never created missionary societies!
[It was not only preaching the Gospel that attracted people to the Lord, but also the very testimony of the individual and corporate lives of the early believers. Their very lives were a testimony unto our glorious Lord.]
Never used Sunday schools!
[This was a creation of men many centuries later in England due to the overwhelming illiteracy of the common people. This is no longer the case. Sunday schools still carry with them the inherent tendency to encourage dependency upon others for Bible-knowledge rather than each person taking responsibility for what they ultimately choose to believe. This is diabolically opposed to 1 John 2:27]
Never had a supreme bishop on earth!
[The idea that the Pope of the Roman Catholic church is a legitimate supreme "bishop" goes far beyond any Biblical integrity. Even worse is the idea that he alone is Christ's representative on earth, as opposed to each and every true believer being His representative, which is scriptural.]
Never used clerical titles for ministers!
[The early church had elders as the overseers and teachers, as is pointed out in 1 Peter 5:1-5. The idea of the first century church having a complex hierarchy such as is practiced in today's churches, again, goes far beyond scriptural integrity. Such structures are patterned after business structures, not the scriptures.]
Never wore clerical or religious garb!
[This in itself would have been foreign enough to them as a practice without having to mention how this, among many other practices in christiandom, are pagan in origin.]
Never allowed women in positions of authority or leadership, either in the home or in the church!
[Women then, as now, have a God-given place in the world and in the family. The drive of feminists to obtain authoritative positions above men speaks of rebellion more than obedience. Although in Christ there are no distinctions, our function in the church and in the family unit are still laid out by God for both men and women. Deviation from this can only be judged as rebellion. There is no shame in a woman serving in the capacity that God has given for women.]
Never had earthly priests!
[Each true believer is a priest unto the Most High God. Anything else is a counterfeit.]
Never voted a person into any church office!
[Elders were eventually selected by the apostles, but this practice came much later in Paul's ministry here on earth, and there is indication that he had good reason and intent for instructing this to be done in the first century as opposed to today's general practice of voting elders into "office" without these reasons and intents existing.]
Never had a Ministerial Association!
[Fellowship and each believer functioning in the body of Christ was generally understood and encouraged without forming man-made organizations. We as a corporate body are a living, breathing organism, not merely an organization.]
Never wanted a World Council of Churches!
[Looking at this organization, the apostasy of such a thing becomes quite clear to those with eyes that see and whom also understand that such an entity is not of God. Such an organization relies upon worldly, carnal wisdom to solve problems and overcome obstacles rather than upon the Head, which is Jesus Christ alone. Various members of the World Council of Churches do not recognize Christ as the Head, but look to their own intellect and pagan deities (demonic beings) for such decision-making.]
Never used ornamental crosses!
[Whether Christ was crucified on a tree with a cross member or not, it is still a symbol of torture and shame. Christ has risen above such shame and instruments of torture. He is the risen, living Lord of glory, Who is no longer on the cross nor in the tomb. We, however, in this life are instructed to take up our crosses daily as He did in His earthly life.]
Never used statues, prayer beads or candles, nor admired relics of cloth, wood, metal or stone!!
[Each of these and other articles and practices have been proven to have their roots in earliest paganism. There is absolutely no integrity in any attempt at christianizing such relics and practices. They are all pagan, therefore cultic and should have no foothold in the life of a true believer.]
Never celebrated Christ's birth or resurrection!
[There is no Biblical mandate, or allowance, for such observances. We may rejoice that He came to redeem us and is risen, but to involve ourselves in holidays that have their roots in, and are symbolic of, paganism speaks of a falling away from truth for which there is no excuse.]
Never gloried in numbers or physical wealth!
[Although much of the first century church experienced poverty, their needs were still met through mutual provision, fellowship, caring, and love. They were family. This stands in stark contrast to today's strong individualism in the various bodies of believers.]
Never mixed with politics!
[Today's churches are a mixture of religion, politics, business, and paganism. Not one of these things has a place in the true body of Christ. None of these things can be physically added to your body, therefore we should not attempt to add these to the living, breathing, singular body of believers.]
Never begged for money from the general public!
[This practice is very prevalent in today's "ministries." Again, if it is of God, then it will thrive based upon His supplying the increase rather than our having to allow the unbelieving public access to any measure of authority in our midst.]
The first century church had greater influence upon the world than all other generations of Christianity combined. Many profess to admire them and so very few actually imitate them.
How is it with you? Would you like to walk like the early Christians? It is not a matter of establishing the first century model. Models have a tendency to become concrete, therefore inflexible. We are to be flexible for the Lord to use as He will. It is more a matter of the attributes and lifestyle of family and body-life dynamics that far exceed virtually anything that exists in today's organizations of churches.
Did you know?
The early Christians were well Organized!
Please do not think that the early Christians were not organized--they were. The one who organized the universe and set all of the stars in orbit is the same one who said, "I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it." (Matthew 16:18) With Him as the organizer, the result is a living organism, not an organization. Furthermore, "the Lord added to them (the church) daily such as should be saved." (Acts 2:47) Man cannot organize a simple living cell, but God has. With Him as the Author and Finisher, the result is life, not lifeless organizational structure.
In finality, "God set the members, every one of them, in the body (the church), as it pleased Him." (1 Corinthians 12:18) This whole composite structure, "In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto a holy temple in the Lord an habitation of God through the Spirit." (Ephesians 2:21-22) Only a religious infidel would think that he could improve on this Divine organization, and the apostles certainly never dreamed of attempting to successfully usurping this from the Lord.
Did you know?
When a broken-hearted, formerly unbelieving sinner calls upon the Name of the Lord Jesus Christ for forgiveness and salvation, that penitent believer is instantly born again--"for the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord," (Romans 6:23; 10:13) and that gracious miracle, or new creation in Christ (2 Corinthians 5:17), makes him a living member of the one, true, spiritual church--"for by one Spirit are we all baptized into ONE body ..." (1 Corinthians 12:13; Ephesians 1:22-23. (Emphasis mine))
Did you know?
All true Christians are in that one true church. Christ alone adds the members to it. However, most Christians today are walking in a variety of man-made "churches"--divided by sectarian attitudes and denominated by different names. In the Bible, this condition is referred to as "carnal babies walking like men" (i.e., the Christians were acting like natural, unregenerate and uninspired men), see 1 Corinthians 1:10-13 and 3:1-4.
Christians are commanded by the Head of the church to walk in the truth that we are all "One Body in Christ," see Ephesians 4:1-6. Most preachers will admit this is what should be done. At the same time, those very preachers desire to keep their popular, traditional divisions and just have a token unity on occasion. Of course, this in no way suggests that today's ecumenical movement is to be accepted. Truth should never be sacrificed on an altar of unity. When truth is the force of distinction in relation to the false teachings of paganism, then it carries the mark of God. The early Christians were not concerned about what was popular--they simply purposed to walk in God's Word. Some Christians are endeavoring to walk in the truth today. How is it with you? Would you like to walk with us--in the truth?
Did you know?
Someone may still ask, "So, what church are you a member of--or what do you call yourselves?" I would like to answer this way--If the Apostle Paul were here, and you asked him that question, how do you think he would answer? Would Paul say, "I'm a Baptist," or "I'm a Methodist?" You would respond, "No! because those names were not used that way back then." Would Paul then say, "I'm a Roman Catholic," or "a Pentecostal?" Again you would respond, "No! the Bible does not say that!" So then, how would Paul or any of the saints back then answer? One man may respond by saying, "I guess Paul would simply say he was a member of the body of Christ or something like that!"
Yes! The various designations of the church in the Bible like, "the body of Christ," or "the church of God," "the church in Corinth," "the church at Ephesus," were never intended to be sectarian names but, rather, the simple descriptions of what they were and the common property of all believers. Why we cannot return to original Christianity and practice the simplicity and purity of church life that was patterned for us is unreasonable at best. The fact is we can, and surprisingly enough many have done it throughout the centuries, though their stories have rarely been told on the pages of traditional "Church History."
Did you know?
Whenever and wherever a group of Christians begin to discover the beauty and holiness of meeting together outside of man-made religious traditionalism and under the headship of the Lord Jesus Christ alone, they will have a sparkling revival in their souls and an enthusiasm that cannot be abated. They will discover anew the realism and vitality of God's Holy Word and turn from every pollution of man's religious invention. Like the kings of Judah of old--Asa, Jehoshaphat, Hezekiah and Josiah--they will clean out of their lives the idolatry and paganism of our modern "high places." In addition, they will reactivate for themselves the only efficient system that Almighty God has designed--which is the proper spiritual church life as exemplified in the pages of the Greek Scriptures. Nor will they hesitate to implement proper disciplinary judgment, which, of necessity, must accompany such profession of godliness. (See 2 Chronicles 19:5-5 and 1 Corinthians 5:1-13)
When this enthusiasm is truly heaven-inspired, unselfish and unprideful, there will once again be granted to them the privilege of functioning in a local congregation as God designed it and Christ, Himself, will be the Head. Such Biblical Christianity cannot help but be admired by believers and hated by Satan. Success in these days of apostasy should never be judged in the quantity of numbers but by the quality of members. Faithfulness to God's Word is the standard for judgment--not theatrical success in a Babylonish, religious performance.
They did indeed built meeting places in the early church. Maybe they weren't recorded in the Bible but there are findings that they had dug under ground and had hidden meeting places to avoid the intense persecution that was going on at the time.
Never built "church" buildings and sanctuaries!
I so agree with this!!! I just learned that early Christians called it the meeting place. The "church" is the body of true believers. But they did build places to meet in.
Never incorporated with the state!
Not sure what your point is here? Are you saying we to not accept tax exemptions for our charitable giving?
Never perpetuated denominational names (distinctions based upon doctrinal differences)!
We humans like to label things to make it easy to distinguish each other. They were called Christians at Antioch and they were also called followers of The Way so some labeling for distinction was given in the early church and is recorded in the bible.
Never had a central headquarters on earth!
I agree here! Want to kill the monster, go for the head, I think Satan knows this and makes it easier for him to attack.
Never maintained human membership roles!
Not so sure about this. How are you to be set someone outside the body for disciplinary purposes if they are not in the body as a member. Membership is need to practice church discipline as described in Matthew 18. Also many Jews were afraid of being set out or the synagogue. I think examples of membership is found in the Bible.
Never built or conducted seminaries!
Not sure what the point is here. When a missionary goes to far off countries they set up a school to educate people on how to read so they can read the bible in their tongue. And there is nothing wrong with Christian education as long as it stays Christian. Problem is they don't.
Never created missionary societies!
What does go in to all the world and preaching the gospel mean? Or maybe I do not understand what a missionary societies is based on your definition!
Never used Sunday schools!
I do not think it is a bad thing when it is done properly. Problem is, it rarely is done properly.
Never had a supreme bishop on earth!
ROCK ON DUDE!
Never used clerical titles for ministers!
Pastor/preacher is good enough and is biblical.
Never wore clerical or religious garb!
Maybe, that could be an argument from silence. But I have heard that the reformers and puritans wore a rob to cover themselves to not distract from the Word. But as always pride in the heart rises and it becomes a sin. I think it has more to do with the heart here.
Never allowed women in positions of authority or leadership, either in the home or in the church!
I agree! But I will bite my language here to stay out of trouble.
Never had earthly priests!
Agree! Jesus Christ is our high priest.
Never voted a person into any church office!
I do not see the problem here.
Never had a Ministerial Association!
I do not think this is a bad thing either. There is power in organization and numbers and things can and have gotten done to advance the gospel. The fact that it has happened and by was done by true Christians proves God uses these methods. Again this is subject to your definition of Ministerial Association.
Never wanted a World Council of Churches!
Agree. Read killing a monster above.
Never used ornamental crosses!
I agree some what, but the places they dug out under ground some where found in the shape of a cross. The symbol has some significance for Christians. Not that we should worship the symbol but it should be a reminder of what our savior went through for us. So to wear it as jewelry with diamond studs... This is a hill I would not be willing to die on.
Never used statues, prayer beads or candles, nor admired relics of cloth, wood, metal or stone!!
YES! YES! YES!
Never celebrated Christ's birth or resurrection!
Not so sure about the resurrection here. They met on the first of the week to celebrate His resurrection and Passover is a time for Christians to reflect on what was done for them, and the Jews were commanded by God to keep the Passover which was a sign of what was to come. As far as Christmas, I'll let Colossians 2 cover me ...So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths... I do not observe Christmas like most people do anymore but I do not want to hinder the message getting out as to why God had to come to earth. Problem is it has become commercialized. I say we Christians should celebrate Christmas in June and throw a wrench in the secular worlds marketing of us.
Never gloried in numbers or physical wealth!
The sin of the American church.
Never mixed with politics!
I do not agree here. We were given freedom by God and this country was founded on Christian principles. One of the founding fathers said take this government out of the hands of Christians and if will fail. Look at what we have and it proves he was right. If government is your calling and you are Christian get in it! Then get in touch with me you will have my vote.
Never begged for money from the general public!
I agree!
Knowing you have a chip on your shoulder toward meeting in buildings clouds the issue here. I think home churches are great and if each member of a home church does as they should in witnessing and sharing their faith and giving for the advancement of the gospel and helping the poor a home becomes to small of a place to meet and a bigger meeting place is needed. There is nothing wrong with that. Now these mega churches that have thousands of people going and would make it difficult to fellowship properly I do see problems rise from them, (not all of them are bad though) but the local church with a hundred or so can be a good and healthy thing and have a positive impact on a community.
Over all this was a good post, was bent towards Catholicism and people who meet in a building that is not a home, and I disagree with that position. I think when done right with a plurality of elder/preachers meeting with a large group of Christians can be a good thing.
Trucker Shared ~ Never celebrated Christ's birth or resurrection! [There is no Biblical mandate, or allowance, for such observances. We may rejoice that He came to redeem us and is risen, but to involve ourselves in holidays that have their roots in, and are symbolic of, paganism speaks of a falling away from truth for which there is no excuse.]
Jude Replies ~ Are you referring to Catholicism ??? I have my Opinions about this and the Holy Spirit has shown me the Observances that Christ Jesus* Requested�This is My Body eat of it�This is My Blood drink of it�Do this in Memory of ME !!!! In Communion with Him�Christ Jesus*�IMHO�It can be done anywhere, anytime, anyplace�
Trucker Shared ~ In finality, "God set the members, every one of them, in the body ( the church ), as it pleased Him." (1 Corinthians 12:18) This whole composite structure, "In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto a holy temple in the Lord an habitation of God through the Spirit." (Ephesians 2:21-22) {{{ Only a religious infidel would think that he could improve on this Divine organization, and the apostles certainly never dreamed of attempting to successfully usurping this from the Lord. }}}}
Jude Replies ~ I agree 50/50 here and Yes !!! The LORD has lead me and countless others to the Body of Christ ( within a Church )�as it Pleased Him�and it is a Building in which We as a Congregation�come together and WORSHIP the LORD and Study HIS WORDS�With out realizing it Trucker�You have just stated that the Pastor of the Sheep within My Church and Others are Relegious Infides for doing what GOD has called and instructed them to do�not Improving on..�That is a Pretty Strong Judgement from one that Has NEVER met these Pastors face to face nor Seen nor Heard the Holy Spirit Speak through them�You have a Right to Your Opinion and View�I just Believe it is of no Profit for a Man to Voice that which He has no First Hand Experience
Do you not know that Christians understand that We are the Body of Christ no matter if We are Walking down the Street or in a Building Worshipping with Voice and Song Fellowshipping in the Spirit of the LORD Jesus*�
Thank you for Sharing�.and Have a GOD filled and Blessed day�xo
P.S. Trucker�What does this mean ? Chesed:
Bible Dictionary Chesed definition~ gain, the son of Nahor (Gen. 22:22) I read this in the Bible and don�t understand what you mean by this in your close of postings�??? Could you please clarify for me�You may contact me privately to explain so not to disrupt the Thread�
I'll strongly disagree with you Dennis and I have the scriptures to back me up. But this subject is like beating your head against a brick wall and since I am not directly involved no need for the headache a this one.
1Cor. 11:23 For I have received of the Lord that which also I delivered unto you, That the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread:
1Cor. 11:24 And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.
1Cor. 11:25 After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me.
1Cor. 11:26 For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do shew the Lord's death till he come.
As far as meeting in homes instead of a building,the fellowship,and family gathering is lost within a building setting.
First all my friends know that I am a dingbat with the computer.
Secondly,there is no such thing as a five fold Ministry.
Eph 4:11 and He gave some as apostles, and some as prophets, and some as proclaimers of good news, and some as shepherds and teachers,
Eph 4:12 unto the perfecting of the saints, for a work of ministration, for a building up of the body of the Christ,
These offices are to be active within the local body,yet when we meet together,there seems to be only one or two people involved controling the people namely the so-called Pastor.
This man picks out almost everything that goes on.
Let's pray,only he prays,
He picks the songs
He does most of the talking.
Where then does the body of people fit in?
As far as people calling themselves leaders,there are to be no leaders within the body.
Here is the Scripture for this.
Mat 23:1 Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples,
Mat 23:2 Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:
Mat 23:3 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.
Mat 23:4 For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers.
Mat 23:5 But all their works they do for to be seen of men: they make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments,
Mat 23:6 And love the uppermost rooms at feasts, and the chief seats in the synagogues,
Mat 23:7 And greetings in the markets, and to be called of men, Rabbi, Rabbi.
Mat 23:8 But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren.
Mat 23:9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.
Mat 23:10 Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.
This is the Greek for the word Rabbi
G4461
ῥαββί
rhabbi
hrab-bee'
Of Hebrew origin [H7227] with pronominal suffix; my master, that is, Rabbi, as an official title of honor: - Master, Rabbi.
From a compound of G2596 and G2233; a guide, that is, (figuratively) a teacher: - master.
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Posted : 28 Sep, 2010 01:02 PM
Points that can not be ignored by all.
What is the 5 fold minnistry? does it not mention Pastors and prophets trucker?
Mr Row and trucker just to remind you phillup had 7 daughters that were prophets.
A prophet is a church leader no if's and's or but's
I also know the resserection statement is wrong.We have passover and the early church did still celebrate it.
Dennis over time much of what the first century believers had taught,and had done when they met together,this for the most part has been lost;or kept from the people.
Men want to control the people,because they fear the people learning the truth about Who they are in Yeshua.
And what is their position and authority within the assembly of the Saints of YHWH.
Shalom and Chesed:
St.George
ps:
Philips daughters were Prophetesses.
A prophet is one which speaks for the word of YWHW.
1Corinthians 14:3 But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort.
Trucker shared ~ We proclaim Yeshuas death, not the Passover.
Ummmm...Is that right ???
Are we as Christians to Proclaim Jesus* Death ? No !!! As this Passage states� 1Cor. 11:26 For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do ( shew ) the Lord's death till he come. That�s right�Show not Proclaim
We are to Proclaim HIS Resurrection...He has Risen and LIVES...:yay:....
As far as the Passover...this is the Hebrew/Israel/Jewish way of Life and Jesus* Lived it and Participated in ALL Feasts and Appointed Times for and by the LORD with His Family and Disciples.
During this very Specific Passover�prior to the Betrayl�He took the Bread ( Body ) and Wine ( Blood )�and Said do this in Memory of ME !!! Jesus* NEVER said Don�t Do This ( Passover ) and Start Doing this ( Communion )�He Added to�in Remembrance of HIM�Not took away the Fellowship with Others and HIM�and in the prior Past Passovers with Jesus*�I�m pretty sure it was done Most Often in a Room or Building�with Songs of Praise and Worship� :-)
You are Correct we do not Proclaim Passover�BUT�Let us not Forget the Passover�For it is for Christians the Memory of His Crucifiction�( Payment in full of our Sins ) and Resurrection ( The GOD of the Living and The Living GOD )
I believe Trucker is Offended in some way by Organized Congregations that Fellowship in this manner and is stating he doesn�t agree with it and does not participate in it�Oky Doky�but Please Respect Others that Do Believe in this type of Fellowship instead of Telling the Sheepels as you call them that it is Wrong to do so�
Have a GOD filled and Blessed day Today and Always�Luv Ya ALL�xo
