Thread: Men AND WOMEN,both receiving the Grace of the Holy Spirit to teach !
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Men AND WOMEN,both receiving the Grace of the Holy Spirit to teach !
Posted : 18 Sep, 2014 04:49 PM
Hello everyone:
I hope everyone will look into the Word of GOD concerning this matter,of women being pastors,evangelists,teaching,etc.
We will look into the Scriptures within the letter to the ASSEMBLIES within the Ephesian congregations.
Eph 4:1 Then I, the prisoner in the Lord, exhort you to walk worthily of the calling in which you were called,
How many times is the word 'you' used in verse one alone '2' times,the word you is PLURAL.
Eph 4:2 with all humility and meekness, with long-suffering, bearing with one another in love,
Eph 4:3 being eager to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.
Eph 4:4 There is one body and one Spirit, even as you also were called in one hope of your calling;
Verse 4, 'you' and your',again both plural.
Eph 4:5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism,
Eph 4:6 one God and Father of all, the One above all and through all and in you all.
Eph 4:7 But to each one of us was given grace according to the measure of the gift of Christ.
Notice the word 'each',the Scripture does not say 'to men only',but to EACH one 'GRACE' is given.
Eph 4:8 Because of this, He says, "Having gone up on high, He led captivity captive," and gave "gifts to men." Psa. 68:18
The word 'men' here is the Greek word 'ANTHROPOS' which speaks of MANKIND,not just men only.
So then 'doma' or gifts 'plural' are given to BOTH men and women.
The list of those 'gifts' are in verse 11.
The word 'some' should not be in the text.
As these 'gifts' are available to anyone,not just the self called pastors,evangelist,prophets,or teachers.
Eph 4:9 But that He went up, what is it except that He also first came down into the lower parts of the earth?
Eph 4:10 He that came down is the same who also went up above all the heavens, that He might fill all things.
Eph 4:11 And indeed He gave some to be apostles; and some prophets; and some evangelists; and some pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 with a view to the perfecting of the saints for the work of the ministry, for the building up of the body of Christ,
Eph 4:13 until we all may come to the unity of the faith and of the full knowledge of the Son of God, to a full-grown man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ,
Now let us look into 1st Timothy 2:12
which has caused much division within the body of Yeshua.
1Ti 2:11 Let a woman learn in silence, in all subjection.
1Ti 2:12 And I do not allow a woman to teach nor to exercise authority over a man, but to be in silence.
Let us look into this Scripture to see what GOD Almighty is saying to the body of Messiah.
1Ti 2:11 Let a woman learn in silence, in all subjection.
English-learn
Greek-manthan�
Strong's Concordance
manthan�: to learn
Original Word: μανθάνω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: manthan�
Phonetic Spelling: (man-than'-o)
Short Definition: I learn, ascertain
Definition: I learn; with adj. or nouns: I learn to be so and so; with acc. of person who is the object of knowledge; aor. sometimes: to ascertain.
HELPS Word-studies
3129 manth�nō (akin to 3101 /mathētḗs, "a disciple") � properly, learning key facts; gaining "fact-knowledge as someone learns from experience, often with the implication of reflection � 'come to realize' " (L & N, 1, 27.15).
This is the same Greek word Yeshua used when He told Hid Apostles to 'disciple' others.
This Greek word means to be a 'learner' of Yeshua the Messiah.
So the woman is to be a learner / disciple.
English-silence
Greek-h�suchia
Strong's Concordance
h�suchia: stillness
Original Word: ἡσυχία, ας, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: h�suchia
Phonetic Spelling: (hay-soo-khee'-ah)
Short Definition: quietness, silence
Definition: quietness, stillness, silence.
HELPS Word-studies
Cognate: 2271 hēsyx�a (from hēsyxos, "quiet, stillness") � quietness, implying calm; for the believer, 2271 (hēsyx�a) is used of their God-produced calm which includes an inner tranquility that supports appropriate action. This term "does not mean speechlessness, which is more directly indicated by 4602 (sigḗ) (J. Thayer). See 2272 (hēsyxios).
This does not mean that a woman cannot speak,she is to give way to teaching.
Men AND WOMEN,both receiving the Grace of the Holy Spirit to teach !
Posted : 19 Sep, 2014 08:46 AM
Wow, this is totally hilarious~
This provided me with a very good laugh, a hardy laugh; I needed it!
Wow, this is great, this is better than watching television with all of its �programming�.
There is not one scripture in the whole canon of the anointed writings, which supports this heresy you are setting forth as a biblical doctrine.
First of all, as to your comments on the "Assemblies of the congregations within the Ephesian congregations�,
The word �congregations� is not even used once in the New Testament, and you have used it repeatedly~
Put the heresy down!
Believers are cautioned twice in the anointed writings, not to add to the Word of God/Elohim, or take anything away from it. [See Deut 4:2, and Revelation 22:18-19]
You just added �congregations� to the text of the New Testament.
You may want to reconsider the practice of tampering with the Word of God~
The word �congregation� (singular) [G-4864, synagōgē or �synagogue�] is used only once in the New Testament, but not in the Paul�s letter to the churches in Ephesus.
Now, your having touched this word �congregations� opens up a whole new can of worms. Are you Jewish? Are the people who you are �instructing� here, Jewish? Are your intentions to address a letter to the synagogues? You do not have the authority to address a synagogue, Paul did, he was a Pharisee, and had their bogus certification of having attended a Yeshiva (Seminary). Jesus was not �credentialed� by the Pharisees, and this is what angered them. He had massive crowds following the Father teaching, through Him, and the whole religious system, in Jerusalem was in danger of collapse.
The word �synagogue� is used 57 times in the New Testament, but in every instance it is used is in regards to a synagogue of the Jews. This use of the word �synagogue� by you, that Paul was addressing the "Assemblies of the synagogues within the Ephesian synagogues�, proves that you do not know what you are talking about. If you do not know that the centric argument in the synagogues, was that the very existence of the synagogues themselves are an abomination unto God/Elohim, and that the Body of the Man is the Temple in which the Holy Spirit resides, you know nothing absolutely about the scripture.
Have you ever noticed that the Books of the Whole Bible were all written by men, not one by a woman?
Have you ever noticed that the New Testament was written by men who were addressing only other men?
This is why you will find nothing, which tells a woman that she can teach the Word of God. Women have never been permitted to teach the Word of God, for is a role reserved for men only, who are the Priests and women their Tabernacles. Women of God can teach/instruct other women how to be in subjection to their husbands, but this is the extent of what they are permitted to teach:
�The aged women likewise, that they be in behaviour as becometh holiness, not false accusers, not given to much wine, teachers of good things; 4That they may teach the young women to be sober, to love their husbands, to love their children, 5To be discreet, chaste, keepers at home, good, obedient to their own husbands, that the word of God be not blasphemed.� Titus 2:3-5
This is also the reason why you did not address specifically the issue of women not being permitted to �teach� men in this post. Don�t think that I did not notice that you are avoiding this subject in this post. Oh, yes, you are quite cunning. You are writing about �learning�, and �silent�, and �you�, �your�, �each�, and even �gift�, but nothing about �teaching�.
Why haven�t you produced one thing which supports women �teaching�..?
NOW TO YOUR EXPLANATION OF �ANTHROPOS�
You write:
[START]
Eph 4:8 Because of this, He says, "Having gone up on high, He led captivity captive," and gave "gifts to men." Psa. 68:18
The word 'men' here is the Greek word 'ANTHROPOS' which speaks of MANKIND,not just men only.
[END]
It is interesting that you want to proclaim that anthropos [G-444] means �MANKIND,not just men only�, but you do not address the fact, that of the 559 times it is used in the New Testament, 552 of those is specifically regarding MEN or a MAN, and never a woman once. Of the remaining 7 uses, they are never in regards to a woman or women.
Men AND WOMEN,both receiving the Grace of the Holy Spirit to teach !
Posted : 19 Sep, 2014 06:36 PM
He everyone:
To the person calling themself, spirit-----.
Matthew 16:18,Yeshua talks about building His ASSEMBLY or CONGREGATION.
Mat_16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
Mat_18:17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.
We will need to see where the words Assembly,and congregation have their roots.
We will also see that the word 'church' is something man made up.
English- Assembly / congregation.
Greek-ekkl�sia
Strong's Concordance
ekkl�sia: an assembly, a (religious) congregation
Original Word: ἐκκλησία, ας, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: ekkl�sia
Phonetic Spelling: (ek-klay-see'-ah)
Short Definition: an assembly, congregation, church
Definition: an assembly, congregation, , the whole body of Christian believers.
From a compound of G1537 and a derivative of G2564; a calling out, that is, (concretely) a popular meeting, especially a religious congregation (Jewish synagogue, or Christian community of members on earth or saints in heaven or both): - assembly,
NOW,let us see what GOD Almighty says about men.
Did you not say there where only 7 references about women when the Greek word 'Anthropos' is used instead of 'aner'.
Now where does Messiah talk about 'men',oh yeah now i remember.
