Author	Thread: Top Seven Things People Think Are In the Bible
dljrn04 View Profile History	Top Seven Things People Think Are In the Bible Posted : 20 Nov, 2013 01:37 PM Top Seven Things People Think Are In the Bible (That Totally Aren't) Quick preface: If I had to choose one phrase to sum up my deep connection to the Jesus movement, it would probably be the ancient Christian proclamation, Jesus is Lord. (These three words are way more substantial and traditional than the current phrases Christians often point to: God bless America; One nation under God; etc...) Jesus is Lord, for me, means that there are many things that are not - money, nations, football...and, yes, the Bible. I don't worship the Bible. It's the word of God, but it's not the only thing God ever said (in the words of my fantastic mentor and godmother, Lori). Okay, on to the list! #7 - The so-called "Rapture." The Left-Behind series is a fictional tale (an overwhelmingly best-selling fictional tale, but complete fiction nonetheless). It comes from a particular theology that was created around 100 years ago - an admittedly interesting concoction, composed of random pieces from Daniel, Revelation, and Paul's letter to the Christian community in Thessalonica - and has been snatched up by plenty of theologians who act as though this was handed down by God before the creation itself. A brilliant assessment of this harmful, dangerous, and totally non-biblical theology can be found in Barbara Rossing's The Rapture Exposed. Check it. #6 - God Hates _____ (Fill In the Blank). Sorry, Westboro Baptist. I'm not talking about Levitical codes or even judgment and damnation. Show me the verse that has those words. #5 - Everything happens for a reason. This is often coupled with other horrific theological statements said during times of tragedy - e.g. "God must have needed another angel/flower-in-the-garden/whatever" - that simply have no biblical basis. There is, you might say, a trajectory of God and God's people, heading towards a final future of God's commonwealth on earth - but the idea of things happening for a reason is often much more simplistic and harmful, and is often said because we don't know what else to say. it's not in the Bible we're fond of quoting at people. #4 - God is in control. Nope. If anything, story after biblical story shows a God whose mind is changed (Genesis 18:16-33; Exodus 32:1-14; the story of Jonah). There are also stories that go off the deep end (i.e. the entire account of the Judges), where God is seemingly nowhere in sight. This is a difficult concept, I know. If God isn't all-powerful the way we've been taught, then what can we believe in? This is where we have to remind ourselves that our very concept of power is routinely subverted in the biblical story - most alarmingly in the story of Jesus, and his seemingly weak, powerless, and outright shameful death on the Roman version of the electric chair, the cross. #3 - We must accept Jesus into our hearts as our personal Lord and Savior. Nowhere does Jesus ask for this particular act to be done (much less say that it's necessary for salvation) - he says a lot about inviting people to follow him, but doesn't seem concerned about the act of "accepting" him into one's heart. Plus, the idea of a "personal" Lord and Savior (as opposed to the Savior of the world, and a bringer of the community of God) is a relatively recent emphasis that coincides (in part) with the modern focus on the individual - what the presiding bishop of the Episcopal Church, Katharine Jefferts Schori, called "the great Western heresy." Or, as the story goes, when someone asked a Catholic monk if Jesus was his personal Lord and Savior, he responded, "Nope. I prefer to share him." #2 - Jesus died for our sins. Whoa, don't freak out. Walk with me for a second. At least, this particular idea doesn't come from the mouth of Jesus himself. It's nowhere in the Gospel accounts of his life (Mark, Luke, Matthew, or John). The closest we get are in the words of Paul (which, it's important to remember, do not encompass all that Jesus the Christ was/is/will be). In his letter to the Christian community in Rome (3:25) and his first letter to the one in Corinth (15:4), Paul wrestles with this idea (especially in the latter, where the words "Christ died for our sins" is right there, although it's followed with "in accordance with the scriptures," which begs the question - which scriptures? The Hebrew scriptures? The Gospel stories?). There's no doubt that Jesus' death and resurrection mean so very much to those who are connected with his movement. But, this is part of a longer conversation. And worry not - we'll do our own wrestling with this idea of "atonement" in a later post. #1 - God helps those who help themselves. No. Stop saying this. The quote is William Shakespeare's to claim. But, even more than that, the biblical witness points to the opposite of this particular phrase. Again and again, God calls people who can't seem to pull themselves up by their bootstraps - Mary, David, and Moses, to name a few. Okay, fine, I'll name some more: Jonah, Ruth, Paul, Peter, the unnamed woman at Bethany (Mark 14:3-9). Oh, and us. Jason Chesnut Post Reply
View Profile History	Top Seven Things People Think Are In the Bible Posted : 20 Nov, 2013 01:55 PM I actually think this is a terrible article. It's off on several points. I suppose everyone can draw their own conclusions about the content based on their own understanding. Post Reply
View Profile History	Top Seven Things People Think Are In the Bible Posted : 20 Nov, 2013 08:06 PM "I actually think this is a terrible article. It's off on several points." Not saying I disagree with you but it would be nice if you would offer some support for your views on the subject matter on hand in accordance to how God tells us to determine the truth. Even if you don't give us the location of the verses you have in mind at least let us know why you think the way you do. You might find out that you others who share your viewpoints Post Reply
View Profile History	Top Seven Things People Think Are In the Bible Posted : 20 Nov, 2013 10:31 PM RA, Nobody here shares my viewpoints. :laugh: Trust me. I am in the .000001% here. You are new here so you may not be aware that I do normally take the time to detail out my thoughts and post scriptures. I didn't take the time to do that this time because much of my disagreements I have already covered numerous times before in other threads. I have much love and respect for the OP who posted this article. While there is some truth in it, there is also much error, IMO. Post Reply
mcubed View Profile History	Top Seven Things People Think Are In the Bible Posted : 21 Nov, 2013 05:28 PM The closest we get are in the words of Paul (which, it's important to remember, do not encompass all that Jesus the Christ was/is/will be). In his letter to the Christian community in Rome (3:25) and his first letter to the one in Corinth (15:4), Paul wrestles with this idea (especially in the latter, where the words "Christ died for our sins" is right there, although it's followed with "in accordance with the scriptures," which begs the question - which scriptures? The Hebrew scriptures? The Gospel stories?). Am I talking to another Jew� yes the Hebrew Scriptures� there is no forgiveness of sin without the blood, He is the sacrificial Lamb slain before the foundations of the world and Pesach is a shadow of Him� Messiah is to be executed by crucifixion as a thief Psalm 22:16; Zechariah 12:10; Isaiah 53:5, 12; fulfilled in Luke 23:33; John 20:25; Matthew 27:38; Mark 5:27, 28 and the Gospels� what about Messiah is to be executed by crucifixion as a thief Psalm 22:16; Zechariah 12:10; Isaiah 53:5, 12; fulfilled in Luke 23:33; John 20:25; Matthew 27:38; Mark 5:27, 28? Did Y-shua make that up? Or maybe He was going to die of old age then be resurrected� Post Reply
mcubed View Profile History	Top Seven Things People Think Are In the Bible Posted : 21 Nov, 2013 05:32 PM There are also stories that go off the deep end (i.e. the entire account of the Judges), where God is seemingly nowhere in sight. Have you read Judges? When we repented He raised up a Judge to free us. Post Reply
mcubed View Profile History	Top Seven Things People Think Are In the Bible Posted : 21 Nov, 2013 05:34 PM Try reading about Gideon... Y-shua makes an appearance Himself to Gideon (Gideon worshiped the Angle of the Lord) and Gideon obeys the Lord in the army of 300 that frees us from the Philistines!!!! Post Reply
mcubed View Profile History	Top Seven Things People Think Are In the Bible Posted : 21 Nov, 2013 06:17 PM It is the book of Ester that G-d is not mentioned at all. But we see His providence throughout the book. And it is because of G-d�s will coming to pass we still celebrate Purim to this very day. Purim celebrates the deliverance of the Jewish people from the wicked Haman in the days of Queen Esther of Persia. No matter what people want to think G-d�s people will never be destroyed because He said we will last forever! Personally, I think you are always spot on but Jason Chestnut (or what ever his mane is) is a lot to be desired... for what it's worth.... Post Reply
View Profile History	Top Seven Things People Think Are In the Bible Posted : 21 Nov, 2013 10:33 PM OK, so there is a rapture. However, to be clear it is not a rapture in which Jesus comes to the earth to take all of the believers back to heaven with Him. In fact Jesus is going to Armageddon at His second coming and those who are raptured are going there with Him. Lev_19:17 "Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him." God does not command us to do or not do anything that is not in His character. God is not a God of hatred. I think some things happen for a reason, usually people bring things upon themselves, whether good or bad. However some things happen for no reason at all. The rain falls on the just and the unjust. Even so, our faith is what makes our response different than the response of the faithless. I agree that God is not in control of everything in the universe. I believe creation is designed to operate by the laws God created and it operates perfectly as it is designed. God may occasionally intervene in these events, but if they operate as designed then they operate perfectly and do not require constant oversight and control. If we take into account the spiritual and physical laws of the universe and learn to live by them we will have fewer conflicts in our lives and find that more of our life is in tune with God and His design than when we do not. If you din't believe this, step in front of a moving bus next time one goes by and see what happens. Laws are laws, the more we know about them and live with them the easier our life in this universe will be. I assume most of the people in this forum know that you cannot ask Jesus into your heart. You cannot accept Him nor can you make Him Lord of your life. Absolutely!! Jesus did not die for our sins. Jesus died to redeem us - to return us to the Father. Gal 4:4) But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law, 5) To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons. I helped myself to some of my Mother's cash once. God came in the form of my Father and rained His wrath down upon me!! So, I'd say the article is accurate. Fun to read anyway. There are so many more things Christians believe or say that are not in the Bible. What about Communion, Sunday worship, going to church/church buildings, Easter, Christmas, Having only one pastor/leader, altar calls, confessing your sins to priests, Oh yeah and priests, the Papacy, monks, denominations, Jesus' birthday in December, The New Testament is Scripture, to name just a few more practices and beliefs that are not biblical. Post Reply
View Profile History	Top Seven Things People Think Are In the Bible Posted : 22 Nov, 2013 10:03 PM What about the 'wise men' that came to Messiah Jesus birth. Most people think that there was '3' wise men, but the bible doesn't specify how many there were. Just the three gifts, and they conclude that there was 3 wise men. There could have been 2 or 3, or multiple wise men. Post Reply