Now concerning spiritual gifts (in thr KJ, the word gifts is italised, that being due to the fact that it is an added word..the word used, i.e. in the Greek is "pneumatikos" better translated "spiritual matters") brethren I would not have you ignorant (god would not have us ignorant of spiritual matters)".
verse 4 "Now (when?..NOW) there are diversities of gifts but the same spirit. and there aredifferences of Administrations, but the same spirit. And there are diversities operations but it is the same God which worketh (i.e. energizes) in all.
verse 7 "BUT (as in contrast to the above, verses 4- 7) the MANIFESTATION of the spirit (God's spirit in us, the risen lord Jesus Christ, Christ in us) is given to every man to profit withal.
verse 8 "For to one (Here is where the problem is, in the Greek this reads "to each one") is given by ("through") the spirit the word of wisdom to another (again, same word just written about, it is "to each one") the word of knowledge by the same spirit to another one (again, same word, "to each one") faith (the manifestation of faith, i.e. pistis, believing but this is believing based on the word of knowledge, i.e. that that mountain can be moved, for example) by that same spirit to another (again, same word "to each") the gifts of healing (healing is ALWAYS a gift) by the same spirit to another (again, same word "to each) the working of miracles to another (again, same word "to each) prophecy (specificallly, "forth telling" not the prophecy spoken by someone who has the enabling ministry of a "prophet/prophetess") to another (again, same word "to each") discerning of spirits to another divers (again,same word "to each", note that divers is in italics, an added word...the concept here is that every one can speak in tongues) to another (again, same word, "to each") interpretation of tongues
verse 11 BUT (as in contrast to the above) all (this all is the all without exception, not the all without distinction) these worketh ("are energized") that one and selfsame spirit dividing in the Greek "distributing") to every man (man and woman) severally as he will (that is not God, he, the man or the woman who desires to operate the manifestations, a choice of free will.
Now concerning spiritual gifts (in thr KJ, the word gifts is italised, that being due to the fact that it is an added word..the word used, i.e. in the Greek is "pneumatikos" better translated "spiritual matters") brethren I would not have you ignorant (god would not have us ignorant of spiritual matters)".
verse 4 "Now (when?..NOW) there are diversities of gifts but the same spirit. and there aredifferences of Administrations, but the same spirit. And there are diversities operations but it is the same God which worketh (i.e. energizes) in all.
verse 7 "BUT (as in contrast to the above, verses 4- 7) the MANIFESTATION of the spirit (God's spirit in us, the risen lord Jesus Christ, Christ in us) is given to every man to profit withal.
verse 8 "For to one (Here is where the problem is, in the Greek this reads "to each one") is given by ("through") the spirit the word of wisdom to another (again, same word just written about, it is "to each one") the word of knowledge by the same spirit to another one (again, same word, "to each one") faith (the manifestation of faith, i.e. pistis, believing but this is believing based on the word of knowledge, i.e. that that mountain can be moved, for example) by that same spirit to another (again, same word "to each") the gifts of healing (healing is ALWAYS a gift) by the same spirit to another (again, same word "to each) the working of miracles to another (again, same word "to each) prophecy (specificallly, "forth telling" not the prophecy spoken by someone who has the enabling ministry of a "prophet/prophetess") to another (again, same word "to each") discerning of spirits to another divers (again,same word "to each", note that divers is in italics, an added word...the concept here is that every one can speak in tongues) to another (again, same word, "to each") interpretation of tongues
verse 11 BUT (as in contrast to the above) all (this all is the all without exception, not the all without distinction) these worketh ("are energized") that one and selfsame spirit dividing in the Greek "distributing") to every man (man and woman) severally as he will (that is not God, he, the man or the woman who desires to operate the manifestations, a choice of free will.
God bless, yes it is just that simple,
Mr.Ed:
Mikey,you gave no indication as to the nature of the Holy SPirit in this Scripture.
The 'HOLY SPIRIT'
He is called HOLY:
1Cor 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost
LORD:
1Cor 12:5 And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord.
GOD:
1Cor 12:6 And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.
The Holy Spirit,He bestows CHARISMA/gifts to each and every believer in Yeshua.
1Cor 12:7 And to each one is given the showing forth of the Spirit to our profit.
The HOLY SPIRIT is the one who is doing the work within and through each believer.
He is the one EMPOWERING the believers.
The believers are only recipients of the Holy SPirit and His Charisma/gifts.
Free will is not involved here.
GODS will is the important matter.
Shalom:
Mr.Ed
ps:
Please do not belittle Yeshua or the Holy Spirit,by saying that they are not GOD.
Nor suggest that either Yeshua or the Holy Spirit are in any way inferior to ABBA,for they are not.
They are co-equal with ABBA.
The Scriptures from Genesis to Revelation attest to the Divinity of Father,Son and Holy SPirit.
The scripture clearly teaches it is the truth, so when we see those indicating they are the truth in lieu of scripture it is fairly clear where the error is. The gifts of the spirit is not given to all men, first things first one must receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
"to every man (man and woman) severally as he will (that is not God, he, the man or the woman who desires to operate the manifestations, a choice of free will."
I don't see how "he" is man or woman when the prior words said that HE is distributing the gifts, meaning the Holy Spirit.
According to His will, as He chose. He acted as a sovereign in this. He gave them where He pleased, and imparted them in such measure as He chose, is what I get from the study and the Greek concordance.
Cited~"According to his will (κατὰ τὴν αὐτοῦ θέλησιν)
Θέλησις willing: his act of will. N.T.o. Const. with distributions. The Spirit was imparted and distributed as God willed. The hortatory digression ends here. The subject of the Son's superiority to the angels is resumed."
Wesley's notes~ "2:4 By signs and wonders - While he lived. And various miracles and distributions of the Holy Ghost - Miraculous gifts, distributed after his exaltation. According to his will - Not theirs who received them."
King James~God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to His own will.
New American Standard~God also testifying with them, both by signs and wonders and by various miracles and by gifts of the Holy Spirit according to His own will.
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We must test all things by looking at the fruit or how it affects our lifestyle. We must all examine everything in the light of Scripture. We test all things to discern if these reactions are from God, the flesh, or the devil. We test it by seeing whether it honors the Scripture and bears godly fruit in people�s lives.
21 Test all things; hold fast what is good. (1 Thes. 5:21)
16 You will know them by their fruits�17 Every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit�20 Therefore by their fruits you will know them. (Mt. 7:10-20)
11 They [the Bereans] received the word with all readiness, and searched the Scriptures daily to find out whether these things were so. (Acts 17:10-11)
We are exhorted to test the spirits or to discern the spirit behind a teaching and its fruit.
1Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world. (1 Jn. 4:1)
My bible says there are fruits of the spirit and they include self-control, patience, love, forbearance, kindness, joy.
Given the reference above "mikey, I would have to say I am doing pretty well on the forbearance, patience, and self-control side of things. Maybe to you it's no big deal. I look at it this way, its an open forum, I prefer others to do the reproofing when someone is out of line. So, I am still waiting for an adult to step up to the plate. In my life, it is rare that someone gets under my skin. How about you? Been joyful? Been kind? Been in self-control?
Michael, I must agree that this passage is speaking about the works of the Holy Spirit who gives out the gifts to those He so choses to give them to according to the faith that works in the person.
I think the problem arises when you do not cap His name, as you cap your name. There are many on this forum who speak about Jesus and God and the Holy Spirit and use lower case letters, but when they write thier own name they makes sure they cap their name. Respect God's, Jesus' and the Holy Spirit's name just as you do your own name. I can see mistakes... as I too, makes mistakes... well... rather often I make mistakes:laugh: Nevertheless, God's name is to be respected just you make sure you use caps for your name try doing the same when using or referencing to the name of God, Jesus and His Holy Spirit.
This is what thus says the Lord. I have removed the numbering, so that you can clearly understand what the Apostles Paul is speaking here in his letter to the church at Corinth.
Concerning Spiritual Gifts
Now about the gifts of the Spirit, brothers and sisters, I do not want you to be uninformed. You know that when you were pagans, somehow or other you were influenced and led astray to mute idols. Therefore I want you to know that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, �Jesus be cursed,� and no one can say, �Jesus is Lord,� except by the Holy Spirit.
There are different kinds of gifts, but the same Spirit distributes them.There are different kinds of service, but the same Lord. There are different kinds of working, but in all of them and in everyone it is the same God at work.
Now to each one the manifestation of the Spirit is given for the common good. To one there is given through the Spirit a message of wisdom, to another a message of knowledge by means of the same Spirit, to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healing by that one Spirit, to another miraculous powers, to another prophecy, to another distinguishing between spirits, to another speaking in different kinds of tongues, and to still another the interpretation of tongues. All these are the work of one and the same Spirit, and He distributes them to each one, just as He determines.
Unity and Diversity in the Body
Just as a body, though one, has many parts, but all its many parts form one body, so it is with Christ. For we were all baptized by one Spirit so as to form one body�whether Jews or Gentiles, slave or free�and we were all given the one Spirit to drink. Even so the body is not made up of one part but of many. Now if the foot should say, �Because I am not a hand, I do not belong to the body,� it would not for that reason stop being part of the body. And if the ear should say, �Because I am not an eye, I do not belong to the body,� it would not for that reason stop being part of the body. If the whole body were an eye, where would the sense of hearing be? If the whole body were an ear, where would the sense of smell be? 18 But in fact God has placed the parts in the body, every one of them, just as he wanted them to be. If they were all one part, where would the body be? As it is, there are many parts, but one body.
The eye cannot say to the hand, �I don�t need you!� And the head cannot say to the feet, �I don�t need you!� On the contrary, those parts of the body that seem to be weaker are indispensable, and the parts that we think are less honorable we treat with special honor. And the parts that are unpresentable are treated with special modesty, while our presentable parts need no special treatment. But God has put the body together, giving greater honor to the parts that lacked it, so that there should be no division in the body, but that its parts should have equal concern for each other. If one part suffers, every part suffers with it; if one part is honored, every part rejoices with it.
Now you are the body of Christ, and each one of you is a part of it. And God has placed in the church first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healing, of helping, of guidance, and of different kinds of tongues. Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles? Do all have gifts of healing? Do all speak in tongues[d]? Do all interpret? Now eagerly desire the greater gifts, and yet I will show you the most excellent way.
Hope this will help fr a better understanding of about whom Paul is speaking.
Bob and I were talking a couple hours ago. He started in on me right where you left off. bob speaks in tongues, I speak in tongues. bob keeps reading and re-reading this whole section over. He sees me at the keyboard typing away. anyway, i am going to make a point here...so, bob and i talk over the manifestations, passage by passage, but tonight he goes a bit further and into where you left off...the better way, so we read that together. he is telling me that I appear to be a bit angrier than usual. it was a great confrontation, bob and I have an interdependent relationship, we hold each other responsible for our apparent behavior towards each other and our actions towards other folks we deal with. so, I say Bob thanks for pointing out that better way. he is starting to learn about the manifestations other than speaking in tongues. we talk about the fact that the manifestations are actually "toys" in a real sense, you read about seing through a glass darkly, as in, we only have so much vision into what the spiritual realm is, that we are children now and that we put away childish things one day, that is the manifestations..as in when the Lord Jesus Christ comes back...the "see face to face" part.
Charity, the love of God in the renewed mind in manifestation, is the better way because it is always a strategy, we are capable of receiving spiritual knowledge and direction from God at all times, but the fact is that God gives out that "word of knowledge" and what to do with it, that "word of wisdom" on his schedule...so whats left....a whole lot of time where "the love of God in the renewed mind in manifestation" is the better way, always available.
so, ET the bottom line is this: I know what I am talking about, when I say manifestations, its because the bible says manifestations, when the bible says "to each one" it means to each one, as in all the manifestations are available to every believer as he (the man or the woman) wills. and I don't mean on man's schedule, merely that they are available when given (speaking in tongues is always available, the rest, well, this is already too long to repeat what is written in the original post and expound on the "worship manifestations")...but the point is that is what the bible says and that is what the bible means and that is why I say what I say. Yes, I will be told that I am interpreting the bible, that, oh, everyone interprets it differently, that the ord says it too me one way and to them it says something else...ad finitum, blah, blah....BUT I never tire of putting it how it is and not how it is not.
the word is more than a book, it was transcribed by man, but it is all revelation, word of knowledge is revelation, with regard to the bible it is word of knowledge and NOT interpretable by man. How it works is this, we bring ourselfs up to the level of the word and God individually shows us its meaning, i.e "that the eyes of our understanding are enlightened". So, when you choose to want to learn how to speak in tongues ET, write me at my private box and I will send you some links on the how...until then, well its a waste of time to comment on what you think the bible says. The brain has only one purpose with regard to the bible to read it and remember it. The soul only has one purpose with regard to the bible, to exercise free will to believe it......the rest is a waste of time and a personal sin.
I love you ET, do take some time and read what I have said, you have the ability to hide it in your heart..
