...right after Christ Died knew what the correct Interpretation of Scripture was?
I mean...they were hearing it straight from the "horse's mouth" (so to speak) and even up to the time that The Church decided what was and wasn't Inspired Scripture -- they had to know what was the correct Interpretation...right?
I mean how else could they choose which Letters and Books went into The New Testament if they did not already know what it meant?
What I am getting to is if they did (and it's obvious that they had to know)...when did they Lose that knowledge? I mean that we do not hold any One Church as having that Knowledge...of holding that Full Deposit of Faith and use Scripture to Interpret Scripture.
What happen? Where did that Knowledge go? And How was it Lost?
Thank you, I take it from your post we are in agreement on our 2 definitions of the church. This is difficult to ascertain as the answers seem to be accompanied by why your right and I'm wrong. I am not concerned with that at the moment. I am merely trying to get us to agree on some definitions so we can discuss meaningfully and intelligently. This is proving to be more difficult than I first imagined.
So with the 2 definitions of the church agreed upon ( yours and mine ), let us move on to scripture. Please SIMPLY and SHORTLY define your postion on ' scripture. ' :
"Again, The Church has always had the correct interpretation of Scripture. Even Scripture itself says that
�The Church is The Pillar and Foundation of Truth�
Meaning that The Church has the interpretations and The Full Deposit of Faith left to Her by Her Spouse JESUS CHRIST.
I do not trust myself to interpret Scripture. I do read it and feel whatever Scripture moves me to feel. I do get �insights� and Epiphanies (Sp) from reading Scripture. But when it comes to the Interpretation I acquiesce to The Church�s Interpretation."
If the "Church" has the only interpretation of Scripture, how do you approach that? Is there a book in which you find answers to certain questions regarding Scripture you don't understand, or do you have to approach a certain person for interpretation? You say you don't trust yourself to interpret Scripture... is this as a whole, or is it certain things?
And I still don't agree that the Church IS THE pillar and foundation of truth.. :glow:
From στύω stuō (to stiffen; properly akin to the base of G2476); a post (�style�), that is, (figuratively) support: - pillar.
G2476
ἵστημι
histēmi
his'-tay-mee
A prolonged form of a primary word στάω staō (of the same meaning, and used for it in certain tenses); to stand (transitively or intransitively), used in various applications (literally or figuratively): - abide, appoint, bring, continue, covenant, establish, hold up, lay, present, set (up), stanch, stand (by, forth, still, up). Compare G5087.
From a derivative of ἕζομαι hezomai (to sit); sedentary, that is, (by implication) immovable: - settled, stedfast.
The Scripture posted says the Church is to be grounded and steadfast in its proclomation of the truth.
Not that; truth comes from the pillar and foundation which is the church.
The foundation and truth of the Church is and will always be the Word of YHWH.
Scripture is the Written Revelation from God�Inspired by God and written by men in their own words.
�Where did it come from?�
It came from the minds of men but it was Inspired by The Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit did not dictate it �word for word� but rather Inspired men to write it.
�What Authority does it have?�
�The Authority of Scripture�?
Boy is that a loaded question or what? Scripture is the Revealed Revelation of God. How much more Authority do you want? Now the question is how do you establish this fact? How do you establish that Scripture is The Inspired Word of God? Protestants will tell you that Scripture establishes Scripture! Scripture is what proves that Scripture is Inspired!
Circular reasoning?
How can you say that something proves what it says by reading that same thing that needs to be proved (huh?).
Muslims will tell you the same thing about The Koran�that Mohammad was Inspired by God to write The Koran. Those that follow Betty White and Glen Miller and Joe Smith will tell you the same thing.
�Well�read Scripture (you say)! It is very Uplifting and has Wonderful Truths that will change Lives�
This can be said about many books written by some Great Americans, but that does not make them Inspired.
We as Christians know that it is the Inspired Word of God because The Church has Establish it as being so�as being True! It is The Authority of The Church that Authenticates the Divine Authority of Scripture.
What gives The Church The Authority to do this?
Well, taking The Bible as an Historical Book we can establish that Jesus Christ did exist and that Jesus was either a Lunatic (insane) or Deluded or a Conspirator or just what He said He was�The Son of God!
We can rule out everything but Jesus being exactly what He said He was because of how many people were willing to die for Him and by the accounts of secular scholars and historians.
Following if Jesus was The Son of God�then the Church Jesus started has Complete Authority and the man Jesus established as Vicar of His Church also has complete Authority�thusly The Church has Authority to Authenticate what is or is not The Inspired Word of God. Makes sense?
I�ll go back and give you more examples if you�d like? I also have pie charts if you need to see them?
*The Church: A chain of command organization created by God that is run by men; the head of which is called the Vicar of Christ, who is given authority from God; the leadership of this church is passed man to man through the generations.
*The Bible: Divine, Inspired Revelation from God.
You said about the Bible in your last post: " How much more authority do you want".......excatly what do you mean by that statement?
I also believe that there are churches where there are a group of individuals interpreting Scripture as best they can and finding others that agree with them and either staying where they are or starting their own church.
I also know that not everything in The Bible is considered a Revelation from God. Some of the Bible is accounting (facts and figures) � history (begat�begat). I differentiate between Inspired Writings and Divine Revelation.
Two, are you deflecting here? It seems that we�ve wandered away from the original Thread. You also seem to enjoy semantics. I believe we left off where you were telling me about
No, not deflecting, it seems you hold different definitions of common words that are defined by scripture. I am just trying to get on the same page as you so we are not dicussing apples and oranges. Every organization has its own vernacular as does yours. As soon as I know what you mean by a word then we will know what you are saying.
Please quit deflecting the question, you said scripture is the"Revealed Revalation of God"....Do you believe scripture has authority or not?...simple question, yet; I can't seem to get a answer from you?
