Thread: Asking God for Forgiveness is NOT Bibical --- (this is the surprise)
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Asking God for Forgiveness is NOT Bibical --- (this is the surprise)
Posted : 29 May, 2011 09:09 AM
This is the surprise that I promised : The forgiveness of your sins are not dependent on your asking for forgiveness --- it is unbiblical.
I looked up 8 forms of the word 'forgive' every single place they occurred in the New Testament after weeding out a few that do not apply to the topic here is what I came up with:
Occurs 1 time --- *Forgiveness based on confession. (1John 1:9)
Occurs 4 times --- *Forgiveness based on the blood of Jesus. (Matt26:28 Eph1:7 Col1:14 Heb9:22)
Occurs 5 times --- *Forgiveness given based on nothing. (Matt9:6 Col2:13 Heb8:10-12 Heb10:16-18 1John2:12)
Occurs 7 times --- *Forgiveness based on Faith. (Matt9:2-6 Mark2:5-10 Luke5:20-24 Acts10:34 Acts13:39 Rom4:7-9 Jam5:15)
Occurs 8 times --- *Forgiveness based on as we Forgive others. (Matt6:12-15 Matt18:21-35 Mark11:25 Luke6:37 Luke11:4 2Cor2:7-10 4:32 Col3:13)
Kind a of Occurs 9 times --- *Forgiveness based on repentance. Note: Of the the first five none reference anyone interacting with Jesus, that leaves only 4 verses in Acts, meaning all but two where written by Luke and the two in Mark, one is about John the Baptist and the other a quote of Isaiah. (Mark1:4 Mark4:12 Luke3:3 Luke17:3-4 Luke24:47 Acts2:38 Acts5:31 Acts8:22 Acts26:18)
Forgiveness based on asking for forgiveness Occurs 0 times in the New Testament.
I submit to you that asking for forgiveness is a lack of Faith or Understanding of the Gospel. Your sins are already forgiven--- All Of Them---Past Present and Future! Therefore the only thing that remains for us is to receive Forgiveness through Faith and in turn Forgive others as Jesus has Forgiven us.
What about confession and repentance? This is really about Faith, about agreeing with God about our sin and turning to Him. Many think to repent means to turn from their sin, I disagree --- that is only half way. To repent is a 180� u turn, meaning turning from sin and to God. Just turning from sin is Not repentance ; it is only a 90� turn from sin.
Forgiveness is only found in believing Jesus already has forgiven you, confession and repentance is not as much about forgiveness as it is about you cooperating with God to remove sin from your life, sin that has Already Been Forgiven!
Asking God for Forgiveness is NOT Bibical --- (this is the surprise)
Posted : 30 May, 2011 01:39 PM
ET,
Your post was rude and mean spirited and it appears you didn't read past the title.
Your post deserves NO answer, however I will give you a short one:
Romans 8:1 "Therefore, there is no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus,"
ET are you in Christ Jesus?
ET are you condemned?
If you are in Jesus you are not condemned so what is it that you ask forgiveness for?
I assume you are not grasping "no condemnation" and will reply: 'my sins'
Romans 8:2 "because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit of life set me free from the LAW OF SIN AND DEATH" (caps mine)
So now it is your turn ET :
After writing such a post as you did surely you can come up with a Scripture that says 'Your forgiveness is dependent on you asking for forgiveness" or even a example of a person asking Jesus to forgive their sins.
I will be awaiting your post, only a Scripture or a apology will do, no more hateful posts please.
Asking God for Forgiveness is NOT Bibical --- (this is the surprise)
Posted : 30 May, 2011 02:16 PM
"Forgiveness is only found in believing Jesus already has forgiven you."
Surely you have not only said that you needn't ask God for forgiveness, but all those who do are not forgiven, because they believe they it is good to ask...
I think a small vein somewhere in me just popped.
And I hope it isn't your pride that prevents you from asking, I hope you believe it in your hearts...
Because this is a very, very serious matter. It isn't to be taken lightly.
Sin is a dangerous thing, and not being rid of it is even more dangerous. We're talking about heaven and hell here. :/
Asking God for Forgiveness is NOT Bibical --- (this is the surprise)
Posted : 30 May, 2011 02:56 PM
MsMarvel,
Direct pressure on the vein that is bleeding is the best advice!
You said : "Surely you have not only said that you needn't ask God for forgiveness, but all those who do are not forgiven, because they believe they it is good to ask..."
�Yes, you are correct, I have said no such thing, that statement of those not being forgiven because they ask to...I have know idea where you got that from.
You also said: "And I hope it isn't your pride that prevents you from asking, I hope you believe it in your hearts..."
� Actually I think it is pride or false humility that prevents people from receiving forgiveness on God's terms and insisting on receiving forgiveness on their own terms. ie : I am forgiven because I asked God to forgive me....Ummm....EpicFail!.....You are forgiven because God, the Bible and the Death and Resurrection of Jesus says so!
MsMarvel, I am not without sympathy for you as I know this must rock your religious paradigm. I don't think it is any big sin to ask for forgiveness, but you do it only for yourself as a way to maintain your relationship with God...that is Okay, however I think your relationship with God would benefit more from realizing He doesn't hold ANY of your sin against you; it is done, finished, you are in a relationship with the Supreme-ist of beings to ever have or ever will exist and He has said and proved that He Loves you and you are Forgiven.
Yes, sin, confession, repentance are all real things we must deal with, but the Forgiveness of God has already been settled!
*If I am wrong per Scripture....I am listening....show me.
Asking God for Forgiveness is NOT Bibical --- (this is the surprise)
Posted : 30 May, 2011 03:35 PM
Actually, no one said that their forgiveness is based on asking to be forgiven, God forgives us are sins because he's faithful and just, and filled with love. But you should feel sorry for sinning, and be moved in your heart to want to be forgiven and change.
If you're not feel convicted there's something terribly wrong going on.
Asking God for Forgiveness is NOT Bibical --- (this is the surprise)
Posted : 30 May, 2011 04:16 PM
Two wrote - "The Holy Spirit wouldn't let you sleep well at night!...lol."
You're probably right. So just don't steal from me, okay? :laugh:
But seriously... Using Matthew 6:15 as a guideline, if I don't forgive you, what happens according to this verse? There is a consequence. God will not forgive my sins if I don't forgive you for stealing from me. How would that fit into your thought?
"But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses."
Asking God for Forgiveness is NOT Bibical --- (this is the surprise)
Posted : 30 May, 2011 04:22 PM
MsMarvel,
I am not being picky, however I do want to point out wrong thinking per Scripture, after all isn't that what caused the fall of man!
You said in your post this phrase: "to want to be forgiven"
This is exactly the kind of thing I am talking about. As a Christian you are already forgiven; there is no "to be" forgiven.
Maybe this will help you understand :
Let's say you have a child and you have done everything to prove your unconditional love for them, yet every single day they ask for your forgiveness when you hold nothing against them. --- Honestly --- After a while how would that make you feel?
Asking God for Forgiveness is NOT Bibical --- (this is the surprise)
Posted : 30 May, 2011 04:45 PM
Okay... What about this..
The disciples asked Jesus how they should pray and he said
Pray like this:
Our Father in heaven,
may your name be kept holy.
10 May your Kingdom come soon.
May your will be done on earth,
as it is in heaven.
11 Give us today the food we need,[a]
12 "and forgive us our sins,
as we have forgiven those who sin against us."
13 And don�t let us yield to temptation,[b]
The Lord's prayer, now you can argue that Jesus had not yet died on the cross...so this prayer might be invalid, right?
Think also of 13 Is anyone among you in trouble? Let them pray. Is anyone happy? Let them sing songs of praise. 14 Is anyone among you sick? Let them call the elders of the church to pray over them and anoint them with oil in the name of the Lord. 15 And the prayer offered in faith will make the sick person well; the Lord will raise them up. "If they have sinned, they will be forgiven."
This is after Jesus... He is saying here, that they pray and they'll be forgiven, why make mention of that if it's not biblical to ask?
Asking God for Forgiveness is NOT Bibical --- (this is the surprise)
Posted : 30 May, 2011 04:49 PM
Yes, OUR SINS ARE FORGIVEN. Because Jesus died on the cross for our sins, we are in need of no more sacrifices, his sacrifice for us was all we needed. But you still ought to ask for forgiveness.
You're burning fuel for this discussion off technicalities.
No the Bible doesn't technically say "Ask for forgiveness, even though Jesus died for your sins."
The Bible says the Lord provides for us, does that mean that we don't need to ask him to provide for us anymore, or we shouldn't pray that the Lord provides? No. It says to pray to him, and ask him.
