The deceptiveness of �free will� is found in its so-called simplicity: IF �we choose� to obey God, we can; and if �we decide� to rebel against God, we can do this too. The problem with this thinking is that in what �we can do� to please God, this is WORKS, and therefore NOT the grace of God at work, so that we could be willing to be doing under HIS workmanship, NOT �ours�.
At this present time, there are but a FEW who are acting according to the election of grace (Rom 11:5). Note that this election process is of grace: Now if it is �by grace�, [God working] then it is no more �of works� [�our own work/choosing�]; Otherwise it is no more grace (11:6). Grace by works is because we have not obtained election by grace without works: Most herein found are blind to their contradiction of being �in works for grace� (11:5-7); And this is because God has given them a slumbering spirit (11:8); And this is so that they could be entrapped (11:9); And this is because they cannot hear what they need to hear, and see what they need to see (11:8). These believers have stumbled unto falling into darkness (11:11-10).
Those who love this darkness of being into �Their Own Works� rather than the light of being in God working ARE IN CONDEMNATION (Jn 3:19 and 21). Whatever we are into which we have done for �Our� justification [�our will, way, words, or works�], and we have fallen from grace/God�s will, way, words, and works (Gal 5:4). Unless we can acknowledge God�s will, we do not get repentance to be in this truth, so that we could be recovered from the devil�s will (2Tim 2:25-26). The faithful saying is (NOT by �our will�) but dead with Him, so that we could live with Him, and suffer with Him, so that we could reign with Him: Deny this, and He will deny you! (2:11-12). NOTE He cannot deny self (2:13); IT IS �WE� WHO ARE TO DENY �SELF� (Matt 16:24).
Whosoever wills {is in �their own will�} loses the ability to come after Jesus unto losing their soul (16:25-24 and 26); Beware of this leavening doctrine of the Pharisees [free will] (16:11-12). IF you believe in God by �your choice/choosing� then you are trapped into worshipping God in a place on this earth, in your body when God says He does NOT dwell in temples/churches that have been made with �men�s hands� (Acts 17:24-25). God is commanding everyone everywhere to Repent of This IGNORANT worship! (17:30); Because God says we MUST worship Him in spirit, and in truth (Jn 4:24-23). Humanity has fallen from God�s will be done in spirit into man�s will be done in body! The fall is from being IN spirit (Is 31:3).
Disciples are known for their love towards one another, in the truth, AND in the actions of love including affection, and esteeming others above yourself because the Royal commandment is to LOVE...
(Rom 12:10, Gal 5:13-14, Eph 4:2, Heb 10:24, 1Pet 1:22, 1Jn 4:7)
God's word is his will and the opinins stated here have nothing to do with the will of God, a dead could read scripture and readily see thru ur error of unbelief, the word of truth never changes.
First you and those who do not know, God has elected that ALL of His creation be saved and returned back to Himself. He did not creat us to be lost inot hell fire.
God has CALLED AND CHOSEN AND ELECTED EVERYONE to be saved trhough His fre gift of salvation, and receive His grace, and His salvation plan. FOR WHEN WE ALL WERE STILL SINNERS CHRIST DIED FOR ALL. not just for those who think they are the elect. God has elected the we ALL be saved and return back to him as his children co-heirs with his Son Jesus Christ, and reign with him in his kingdom when he returns.
Secondly, God forknew (before we were created, before the foundation of the world. Thos who WOULD COME to Him, and He also knew those who WOULD NOT COME TO HIM. But His call and invitation to to everyone on this earth to COME AND BE HIS ELECT children in His kingdom. Not just s few or some, BUT EVERY PERSON ON THE FACE OF THIS EARTH HAVE BEEN ELECTED TO COME RECEIVE CHRIST INTO THEIR LIVES. but as God says, Only a few will be chosen, becasue they will obey and COME!
Jesus dies on the cros so that WHOSOEVER COMES. The WHOSOEVER covers every living person on earth.
Hope that answer your question. There are no speacial people chosen before time by God to receive salvation. That a lie and false doctrine to believe such. God has called and chosen ALL OF US whom he created on earth to be His elect children.
We are called the ELECT only becasue we has CHOSEN TO FOLLOW JESUS CHIRST AND HIM ALONE. And not because God has chosen a certain group of people to be His elect. God has chosen ALL of us as His elect who receieve Christ!
No differnet than you have a favorite child our of four children. The cjhild that obeys and does not give you much grief, is your ELECT or FAVORITE child. Same-same, the REDEEMED who obey God's Call to come are His ELECT CHILDREN. Nothing more or nothing lest. We are the CHOSEN OF GOD, BECASUE WE HAVE DECIDE FTO FOLLOW JESUS!
Thanks you very much , I think Elvis has left the building:bow::bow::ROFL:
May I (gently) interject here? This is not a divisive issue, but it is one that challenges man's view of God. I don't think any of us (Calvinist included) can really grasp the soveriegnty, justice and goodness of God on His own terms. I was just about to post before I read the last comment, so I'll say it more strongly. NO absolutely NO is no one ever condemned if the don't believe in election!!!!
Since Two has asked this question several times -
"Foreknew is from "proginosko", a compound word meaning "to know" with meaning beyond that of simply knowing beforehand. In Scripture, "to know" often carries the idea of special intimacy and is frequently used of a love relationship. From foreknowledge, he predestined us ("Proorizo") which means literally to mark out, appoint, or determine beforehand. This is just as Jesus was crucified "by the predetermined plan and foreknowledge of God" (Acts 2:23). (MacArthur's New Testament Commentary, Romans 1-8)
If God lives outside of time and space, then He is able to forknow, choose, predestine, and save all before we were ever born anyway. Because He lives outside of time and space, He is able to predetermine His plan.
Geee, sorry about all the typos in my post... but ya'll already know I can't type. Plus, Elvis didn't send me to school ot learn to type his letters.:ROFL::dancingp:
BTW< 2sparrow, stop whinning like a spoil sissssssy...:yay::devil: no one is over looking your question,
You do not have to understand how God saves you to be saved. God will save you in spite of your bad theology. The only way it could make a difference is, if we played a part in the salvation process, which we do not. Salvation is all of God and none of me.
Thank you for answering. Unfortunately your answer has disqualified you from answering the question I asked....Lol...it is all good!
To explain :
You and Siciiangirl have patted each other on the back, congratulating each other for explaining the doctrine of election. Yet your views on election are polar opposites.
* However ......I am not addressing the doctrine of election in that it is either calvinistic or arminianism. I am discussing the right of either party to condemn the other as Siciliangirl has done.
It is faith only that the Spirit of GOD responds to, and faith does not come from hearing man's corruption of the word. You cannot go around the principles found in the parable of the sower.
:ROFL:.. 2sparrow this is why Ilove you , mannn! you are too much:yay:
Firstly it is man hwo has made a doctrine out of God word, based on his own understanding, that is not even discussed anywhere in the bible. Which is the main reason so many people get confused and ARE confesed about being the called, the chosen, and the elect. God never intended for there to be a doctrine and people to based their salvation on a man coined doctrine.
Paul wroite God's words and they mean what they say, and you can find definitions of anyword in a dicitionary a person doesn't understand, and they will know what God is speaking.
The so-called doctrine of election is man's docrtine, and is NOT OF GOD.
The word of God is psirutually discerned which means revealed and understand throught the pwoer of the Holy Spirit. Romans 8: 28-39, is clear, as well as all of Paul's writing about being the elct and predestined, and called, and being the elct. Its man who has made God's word difficult to hear.
We must all understand and know that we are all called (invited) elected (chosen), predestined(determined by God to receive slavation and reign with Jesus, all who receive Him in their life.
Knowing that God is Omnipotent, knowing that God is Omnipresent. Knowing that God is Omniscient, should give us much confidence to know that He is sovereign and doesn't need nobody 's permission to tell HIm what to do, how to do it, when to do it, where to do it, or who do use to do whatever He so desires in Hi own time and space.
Glad I answered your question, and I will disqualify myslef as well:party::yay::rocknroll:
