Thread: 1 Peter 1, Elect; another Calvinist blunder.
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1 Peter 1, Elect; another Calvinist blunder.
Posted : 20 Apr, 2010 11:07 AM
Let's examine 1 Peter 1:1-2. This passage was grossly mistranslated by Calvinists. The Greek says things very differently.
The NKJV, though one of the best translations we have, as with most English translations is very wrong and affects doctrine in this specific passage.
1Peter 1:1 Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, To the pilgrims of the Dispersion in Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,
2 ELECT according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, in sanctification of the Spirit, for obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace to you and peace be multiplied.
In verse two above we see the word "ELECT". When one who is being honest with the grammar of the Greek Texts examines this passage they will find something very different. The word ELECT or CHOICE is not found in verse two of the Greek but in verse ONE. This is very significant.
Young's Literal Translation is much closer to what the Greek says. [ brackets mine]
1Peter 1:1 Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the CHOICE [Elect] sojourners of the dispersion of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,
Notice where the word "choice" or Elect is placed. We are not "Elect" according to God's "foreknowledge". The verse is calling the JEWS of the dispersion as being the ELECT or CHOICE. The Calvinist translators placed the word "ELECT" in the wrong location which is HUGE!!! In the Greek the word "Choice" or Elect" is in verse ONE not two. What an incredible blunder or perhaps incredible bias. Nevertheless it is plain wrong and dramatically affects the meaning of the verse which does not support Calvinism.
2 according to a foreknowledge of God the Father, in sanctification of the Spirit, to obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace to you and peace be multiplied!
"Foreknowledge" is an interesting word and Calvinists have created their own meaning to this word. They would have us believe that it means that God looked into the future and then choze people. The word actually means "having prior knowledge" as in a relationship. A person or people He knew previously. Since the word "ELECT" or Choice sojourners is clearly referring to the NATION OF ISRAEL makes it very clear that foreknowledge is referring to ISRAEL and cannot refer in any way to Gentiles/Christians.
Let's continue with the last phrase of verse 2.
" Grace to you and peace be multiplied!"
This can be correctly placed in the beginning of verse 2 to make it more clear even though it gives the same affect where it is.
2 Grace to you and peace be multiplied according to a foreknowledge of God the Father, in sanctification of the Spirit, to obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ:
You can cross reference Deut 7:6-11 with the above especially 6-7.
Deu 7:6 "For you are a holy people to the LORD your God; the LORD your God HAS CHOOZEN you to be a people for Himself, a special treasure above all the peoples on the face of the earth.
7 The LORD did not set His love on you nor choose you because you were more in number than any other people, for you were the least of all peoples;
8 but because the LORD loves you, and because He would keep the oath which He swore to your fathers, the LORD has brought you out with a mighty hand, and redeemed you from the house of bondage, from the hand of Pharaoh king of Egypt.
9 "Therefore know that the LORD your God, He is God, the faithful God who keeps covenant and mercy for a thousand generations with those who love Him and keep His commandments;
10 and He repays those who hate Him to their face, to destroy them. He will not be slack with him who hates Him; He will repay him to his face.
11 Therefore you shall keep the commandment, the statutes, and the judgments which I command you today, to observe them.
When we examine Romans 8:28,29 & 30 we see the same thing concerning "foreknowledge".
Unfortunately most Calvinists are so bias they will not accept this simple truth.
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either no longer be mistaken or he will cease to be honest.
You said: "That's funny I can't seem to find a council coming together to condemn Calvinism as heresy. That is just your opinion.
Ever heard of the council of Dort?
The Synod of Dort condemned the religious doctrine of Arminianism as heresy. They did not take this matter lightly meeting a 154 times from November 13, 1618 to May 9, 1619 This council is also where the 5 points of TULIP came from, not John Calvin he was long dead before this controversy ever came about. 84 voting representatives from the Reformed churches 8 from foreign countries were invited. So this was no small matter, they took it very seriously. Your arguments seem tiny now.
WALTER:Look at the PRIDE in which you made your statements. Look how prideful you seem because of the Council of Dort's actions. Does one need a bias council to determine an opposing doctrine? Now that's rich. LOL Let's see...a group of Calvinists, who were also politically in control, got a council together which was really a heresy trial to determine if those who believed in Arminian Theology and NOT Calvin's was in error. Does the Roman Catholic Church and their "trials" come to mind?
What did the Calvinists do to those who opposed Calvin's theology?
James Arminius, professor of Divinity at Leyden, was trained in Geneva in the Reformed (Calvinist) tradition. Around 1591 he began to question some of Calvin's teachings, and soon openly taught and wrote in opposition to Calvin. Arminius' writings and teaching gained a considerable following, but brought him no real trouble from the Calvinist majority. However, shortly after his death, the Reformed Church launched a crusade against all prominent persons who were considered "Arminian" in theology. The Council of Dort was allegedly convened for the Arminians to present their arguments against Calvinism in a fair hearing. They were not aware that in reality it was their "Protestant Inquisition" or "heresy trial." The Five Articles of Remonstrance (five grievances) were prepared by the Arminian defendants to present their disagreement with the Church's official Calvinist stand. The five articles outlined the main points where Arminians objected to Calvin's theology. Essentially, they affirmed that man has a free will and the God-given capacity to choose to accept or reject God's efforts to save Him. And, that Christ died for all men, not merely a select group.
***The Council of Dort, led entirely by Reformed Calvinists, completely rejected all five Arminian articles. A persecution of Arminians even to death ensued.
Of the Arminian defendants, John Wesley wrote, "some were put to death, some banished, some imprisoned for life, all turned out of their employments, and made incapable of holding any office, either in Church or State." Rome's wrath had previously fallen upon the Protestant Reformers at the Council of Trent. But, when the once-persecuted Reformed Protestant Church obtained political power themselves, they became the persecutors. They behaved precisely like Rome, killing and persecuting Christians who dared express a theology contrary to the new Protestant state Church. This behavior of the Calvinists was not an isolated incident. Calvin himself had people put to death in Geneva for having the gall to disagree with his theology.
So DarellO, is this what you are defending? Do these Calvinists in any way seem like the Holy Spirit indwelled them? Do you see any Fruit of the Spirit in having people MURDERED, IMPRISONED, etc., for believing differently? Please show us in the New Testament where Christ commanded this behavior.
So was the Roman Catholic Church's persecution of Protestants the work of God or of Satan?
So was the Calvinists persecution of Christians who disagreed with their theology the work of God or of Satan?
You cannot condemn one without condemning the other nor can you praise one without praising the other. It's a double edged sword that cuts you both ways.
So tell me, tell us, is your behavior justified as you would justify the behavior of the Council of Dort? Does the Fruit of the Spirit display arrogance, smugness, hubris, a vicious mean spirit? Or are those behaviors of the FLESH? Look at the Calvinists on this board and tell me that the sins of the fleshly behavior of your group isn't clearly displayed for all to see! This behavior is very typical of Calvinists. But look at the history and the behavior of Calvinists. It should be no surprise?
Before any of you decide to attack me again and point out any harshness or imperfections on my part...just worry about yourselves and try to get yourselves right with God first.
:bouncy:...Did the Shoe drop...or...Is it on the other foot...???...Hummm...:rolleyes:...These are the things that persons do that jus cornfuze the heck outa a child of GOD...Maybe Clavin an Armain should share some of that Fruit instead of letn it rot an then throwin it at others...I never met them, but ifin they be not nice...then...well...I dont wana be hangin out with em...cuz they might try ta still my Fruit afor ima able ta give it ta someone that needs it...Anywho...Has anyone seen my Cowgirl boots..??? Ima in need of em ta get up on my low pony ta get the heck outa Dodge...:goofball:...xo
By the way. The name James Arminius is not correct. (do not tell me it were the calvinists who translated that in English)
:ROFL::ROFL::ROFL::ROFL::ROFL:
His name is Jakob Harmenszoon. He was born in Oudewater, the Netherlands. He was also burried in Holland (Pieterskerk, Leiden).
Have you ever been in the Netherlands to visit the where abouts of Jakob? If ever you do, please let me know. There are some non turistical spots you really need to see.
I believe that men have no business in worrying about elect and predestined. This is a matter for God.
But to answer your question.
I think that IN CHRIST gentiles and jews are equal. I mean that the precious blood of Christ has been shed for both jews and gentiles, although the jews absolutely deny that, they exclude the gentiles.
I know that both Peter and Paul had a different gospel (message with happy contens) for gentiles and jews but I cannot tell you what exactly those differences were.
However, only the children of Israel (jews) are elected by YHWH (Father). His convenant with them has never been cancelled because of Christ or a new convenant. So jews who are converted to christianity still remain the elect even though they have no reason to claim so according to their faith in Christ. However, they are no longer under the Law but share in the saving through Christ.
Gentiles are saved in Christ but are not the elect people by YHWH. Jews are the elect by YHWH but not saved in Christ unless they recognize Jesus Christ as their Messiah.
And as for the christians who fight among themselves over this.... good luck and much joy!
As for myself I am nothing but a sinner on my way to hell...
