Author Thread: What is Apostolic Succession? What is an Apostle?
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What is Apostolic Succession? What is an Apostle?
Posted : 19 Feb, 2010 11:41 AM

Hi Everyone,



PhillipJohn had asked a question pertaining to what an Apostle is. Here is a study i did regarding this some time ago. This will address Apostolic Succession and the definition of what it mean to be an "apostle".



What is Apostolic Succession? Is it Biblical?

Apostolic Succession is the belief that the Apostles of Jesus passed on the power and authority given to them by Christ to their disciples and so on and so on. The Roman Catholic Church makes this claim of an unbroken line from Peter to the present Pope. However when we examine the scriptures we do not find this authority. We actually find the contrary. There are also others who claim to be Apostles OF Jesus Christ in modern times.

Let me say right up front that it is impossible for anyone to become an Apostle "OF" Jesus Christ unless Jesus comes to Earth and appoints you personally. In each case where Christ appointed an Apostle, that Apostle received supernatural powers.



Let us first examine what the term "Apostle" means.

G652

apostolos pronounced ap-os'-tol-os

From G649; a delegate; specifically an ambassador of the Gospel; officially a commissioner of Christ ("apostle"), (with miraculous powers): - apostle, messenger, he that is sent.



The meaning is "one who is sent" with the authority *** OF THE SENDER.*** It is NOT an office like a Bishop, Pastor or Elder. It is important to understand this. The little word "OF" is the key to knowing whose apostle you are.



There were all together 13 Apostles OF Christ, then finally down to 12. Judas as we know betrayed Christ and killed himself. So who was the replacement for Judas? Who later became an Apostle "OF" Christ? This means that it is Christ who must appoint that person directly and personally in order to be HIS Apostle. The word "OF" is WHO personally appointed that Apostle.

Paul's own testimony tell us.

Gal 1:1 Paul, an apostle (not from men nor through man, but through Jesus Christ and God the Father who raised Him from the dead), NKJV

On the road to Damascus Paul had an encounter.

Act 22:6 "Now it happened, as I journeyed and came near Damascus at about noon, suddenly a great light from heaven shone around me.

7 And I fell to the ground and heard a voice saying to me, 'Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?'

8 So I answered, 'Who are You, Lord?' And He said to me, 'I am Jesus of Nazareth, whom you are persecuting.'

9 "And those who were with me indeed saw the light and were afraid, but they did not hear the voice of Him who spoke to me.

10 So I said, 'What shall I do, Lord?' And the Lord said to me, 'Arise and go into Damascus, and there you will be told all things which are appointed for you to do.'

When speaking to King Agrippa, Paul gave more details concerning this account.

Act 26:14 And when we all had fallen to the ground, I heard a voice speaking to me and saying in the Hebrew language, 'Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me? It is hard for you to kick against the goads.'

15 So I said, 'Who are You, Lord?' And He said, 'I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting.

16 But rise and stand on your feet; for I have appeared to you for this purpose, to make you a minister and a witness both of the things which you have seen and of the things which I will yet reveal to you.

17 I will deliver you from the Jewish people, as well as from the Gentiles, to whom I now send you,

Act 26:18

to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who are sanctified by faith in Me.'NKJV

There is no question that it was Paul who was appointed by Jesus which made Paul an "Apostle OF Jesus Christ".



But what about Mattias?



While the Disciples were still waiting for the Holy Spirit to descend upon them and give them power as Christ commanded, they appeared to get impatient concerning replacing Judas Iscariot. Consider that the Apostles were not yet with power of the Holy Spirit and so they moved in their flesh and not in the Spirit as they did not possess Him as yet.

Act 1:21 "Therefore, of these men who have accompanied us all the time that the Lord Jesus went in and out among us,

22 beginning from the baptism of John to that day when He was taken up from us, one of these must become a witness with us of His resurrection."

23 And they proposed two: Joseph called Barsabas, who was surnamed Justus, and Matthias.

24 And they prayed and said, "You, O Lord, who know the hearts of all, show which of these two You have chosen

25 to take part in this ministry and apostleship from which Judas by transgression fell, that he might go to his own place."

26 And they cast their lots, and the lot fell on Matthias. And he was numbered with the eleven apostles.



Notice that the apostles made an "ASSUMPTION" that Jesus had chosen one of the two men they mentioned. They were in serious error here as Jesus did not choose either of these men. If Jesus had wanted either of these two men then why didn't HE pick one of them while He was still here for 40 days before HIS Ascention?

So though Matthias was appointed an apostle of the Gospel by the Apostles, he was still not an Apostle "OF" Christ. He was an apostle of an apostle, that is all and he did not have the same powers the original 11 had and that Paul also was given by Christ. How can we confirm that there were only 12 Apostles OF Jesus? See below.



Rev 21:14 Now the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and on them were the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.



One of the things in scripture you should note is that the Apostles never had the power or ability to pass on their specific powers. Yes they chose leaders and yes they had disciples and yes they passed on certain "gifts" to individuals but no one possessed their unique powers of transferring gifts and they did not have the power or authority to appoint someone to be an Apostle "OF" Jesus Christ as only Jesus can personally do that as the scriptures demonstrated.

I want you to notice this scripture below. The historical context is that back then there were people "claiming" to be apostles OF Jesus Christ yet they were not. Remember Jesus only appointed 12.



Rev 2:2 "I know your works, your labor, your patience, and that you cannot bear those who are evil. And you have tested those who say they are apostles and are not, and have found them liars; NKJV



Can we apply this today? I believe so as there are people in modern churches today that also claim to be Apostles "OF" Jesus Christ. How do you test them as they did back then? A true Apostle "OF" Jesus Christ has supernatural gifts one of which is the ability to lay hands on EVERYONE and heal them instantly without exception. Take someone you know who is crippled badly and see if they can get them to get up and walk instantly and be 100% healed. They can cast out demons, they can drink deadly poisons and not get hurt or die and they can handle deadly snakes and will not be injured or die. But as scriptures tell us, Jesus only appointed 12.



Blessings!

Walter

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klmartin62

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What is Apostolic Succession? What is an Apostle?
Posted : 22 Feb, 2010 11:00 PM

"Rev 21:14 Now the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and on them were the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb."







This does not say that there were "Only" twelve...it just says that their were twleve names on each foundation. It could be a memorial for the "Original" Twelve.





Let's do a little research and see if this is true or not. It was written in Greek, so it should be easy to determine who is correct.



Where it says the twelve apostles, the word the is a definite article, meaning that there are none other than the ones spoken of. The real, The true, The only.



ὁ, ἡ, τό

ho hē to

ho, hay, to

The masculine, feminine (second) and neuter (third) forms, in all their inflections; the definite article; the (sometimes to be supplied, at others omitted, in English idiom): - the, this, that, one, he, she, it, etc.



Seems to be self explanatory to me. I can copy from Thayers far a more complete explanation if you have a probler with Strongs.



Blessings,

Leon

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What is Apostolic Succession? What is an Apostle?
Posted : 23 Feb, 2010 06:37 AM

2 Tim. 3:16 (KJV)

All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:



Matthias the 13th Apostle (chosen by the remaining eleven apostles)



Acts 1:26



And they gave forth their lots; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and he was numbered with the eleven apostles.



The scripture does not say that there was a big hurry to choose a new apostle. You can�t read your own theology into the text. If you read your own viewpoint into the text you will always get the wrong interpretation. The Jews used the method of lots to determine who would be the new apostle. Their belief was that God would use divine intervention so that the correct person drew the correct lot thus settling the matter.



The other Apostles



Andronicus and Junia



Romans 16:7 (KJV)



Salute Andronicus and Junia, my kinsmen, and my fellowprisoners, who are of note among the apostles, who also were in Christ before me.



This verse does not indicate that they were popular among the apostles. Rather, it implies they were apostles, known by the apostles. We do not know much about Andronicus and Junia. Perhaps Junia was the wife of Andronicus. Junia is the feminine of Junius. If Junia is indeed a female, then Junia is the only instance of a female apostle in the bible.



Apollos



1 Cor. 4:4-9 (KJV)



For I know nothing by myself; yet am I not hereby justified: but he that judgeth me is the Lord. [5] Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God. [6] And these things, brethren, I have in a figure transferred to myself and to Apollos for your sakes; that ye might learn in us not to think of men above that which is written, that no one of you be puffed up for one against another. [7] For who maketh thee to differ from another? and what hast thou that thou didst not receive? now if thou didst receive it, why dost thou glory, as if thou hadst not received it? [8] Now ye are full, now ye are rich, ye have reigned as kings without us: and I would to God ye did reign, that we also might reign with you. [9] For I think that God hath set forth us the apostles last, as it were appointed to death: for we are made a spectacle unto the world, and to angels, and to men.



Paul includes Apollos along with himself in the apostolate.



Barnabas



Acts 14:14 (KJV)



Which when the apostles, Barnabas and Paul, heard of, they rent their clothes, and ran in among the people, crying out,



Barnabas was the first person to treat Paul as a friend after Paul�s conversion.



Epaphroditus



Philip. 2:25 (KJV)



Yet I supposed it necessary to send to you Epaphroditus, my brother, and companion in labour, and fellow soldier, but your messenger, and he that ministered to my wants.



The word messenger is apostolos in the Greek language which is the same word used to translate apostle.



James, the Lord�s brother



Galatians 1:19 (KJV)



But other of the apostles saw I none, save James the Lord's brother.



Paul



The apostle Paul



Two Unnamed Apostles



2 Cor. 8:23 (KJV)



Whether any do enquire of Titus, he is my partner and fellowhelper concerning you: or our brethren be enquired of, they are the messengers of the churches, and the glory of Christ.



The word messenger is apostolos in the Greek language.



Silvanus and Timotheus



1 Thes. 1:1; 2:6 (KJV)



Paul, and Silvanus, and Timotheus, unto the church of the Thessalonians which is in God the Father and in the Lord Jesus Christ: Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.



1 Thes. 2:6 (KJV)



Nor of men sought we glory, neither of you, nor yet of others, when we might have been burdensome, as the apostles of Christ.



Paul includes Silvanus and Timotheus as apostles along with himself.

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klmartin62

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What is Apostolic Succession? What is an Apostle?
Posted : 23 Feb, 2010 11:20 AM

"

That is just too much of a stretch for anyone to follow. These verses don't say anything close to what you are claiming.

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What is Apostolic Succession? What is an Apostle?
Posted : 23 Feb, 2010 12:24 PM

Ok, here it is with the transliterated Greek to go along with it.



2 Tim. 3:16 (KJV)



All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:



Matthias the 13th Apostle (chosen by the remaining eleven apostles)

Acts 1:26

And they gave forth their lots; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and he was numbered with the eleven apostles.



26 kai edwkan klhrouV autwn kai epesen o klhroV epi matqian kai sugkateyhfisqh meta twn endeka apostolwn





The scripture does not say that there was a big hurry to choose a new apostle. You can�t read your own theology into the text. If you read your own viewpoint into the text you will always get the wrong interpretation. The Jews used the method of lots to determine who would be the new apostle. Their belief was that God would use divine intervention so that the correct person drew the correct lot thus settling the matter.







The other Apostles







Andronicus and Junia

Romans 16:7 (KJV)

Salute Andronicus and Junia, my kinsmen, and my fellowprisoners, who are of note among the apostles, who also were in Christ before me.



7 aspasasqe andronikon kai iounian touV suggeneiV mou kai sunaicmalwtouV mou oitineV eisin epishmoi en toiV apostoloiV oi kai pro emou gegonasin en cristw



This verse does not indicate that they were popular among the apostles. Rather, it implies they were apostles, known by the apostles. We do not know much about Andronicus and Junia. Perhaps Junia was the wife of Andronicus. Junia is the feminine of Junius. If Junia is indeed a female, then Junia is the only instance of a female apostle in the bible.



Apollos

1 Cor. 4:4-9 (KJV)

For I know nothing by myself; yet am I not hereby justified: but he that judgeth me is the Lord. [5] Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God. [6] And these things, brethren, I have in a figure transferred to myself and to Apollos for your sakes; that ye might learn in us not to think of men above that which is written, that no one of you be puffed up for one against another. [7] For who maketh thee to differ from another? and what hast thou that thou didst not receive? now if thou didst receive it, why dost thou glory, as if thou hadst not received it? [8] Now ye are full, now ye are rich, ye have reigned as kings without us: and I would to God ye did reign, that we also might reign with you. [9] For I think that God hath set forth us the apostles last, as it were appointed to death: for we are made a spectacle unto the world, and to angels, and to men.



4 ouden gar emautw sunoida all ouk en toutw dedikaiwmai o de anakrinwn me kurioV estin

5 wste mh pro kairou ti krinete ewV an elqh o kurioV oV kai fwtisei ta krupta tou skotouV kai fanerwsei taV boulaV twn kardiwn kai tote o epainoV genhsetai ekastw apo tou qeou

6 tauta de adelfoi meteschmatisa eiV emauton kai apollw di umaV ina en hmin maqhte to mh uper o gegraptai fronein ina mh eiV uper tou enoV fusiousqe kata tou eterou

7 tiV gar se diakrinei ti de eceiV o ouk elabeV ei de kai elabeV ti kaucasai wV mh labwn

8hdh kekoresmenoi este hdh eplouthsate cwriV hmwn ebasileusate kai ofelon ge ebasileusate ina kai hmeiV umin sumbasileuswmen

9 dokw gar oti o qeoV hmaV touV apostolouV escatouV apedeixen wV epiqanatiouV oti qeatron egenhqhmen tw kosmw kai aggeloiV kai anqrwpoiV







Paul includes Apollos along with himself in the apostolate.







Barnabas

Acts 14:14 (KJV)

Which when the apostles, Barnabas and Paul, heard of, they rent their clothes, and ran in among the people, crying out,



14akousanteV de oi apostoloi barnabaV kai pauloV diarrhxanteV ta imatia autwn eisephdhsan eiV ton oclon krazonteV





Barnabas was the first person to treat Paul as a friend after Paul�s conversion.



Epaphroditus

Philip. 2:25 (KJV)

Yet I supposed it necessary to send to you Epaphroditus, my brother, and companion in labour, and fellow soldier, but your messenger, and he that ministered to my wants.

25 anagkaion de hghsamhn epafroditon ton adelfon kai sunergon kai sustratiwthn mou umwn de apostolon kai leitourgon thV creiaV mou pemyai proV umaV



The word messenger is apostolos in the Greek language which is the same word used to translate apostle.



James, the Lord�s brother

Galatians 1:19 (KJV)

But other of the apostles saw I none, save James the Lord's brother.



19 eteron de twn apostolwn ouk eidon ei mh iakwbon ton adelfon tou kuriou





Paul

The apostle Paul



Two Unnamed Apostles

2 Cor. 8:23 (KJV)

Whether any do enquire of Titus, he is my partner and fellowhelper concerning you: or our brethren be enquired of, they are the messengers of the churches, and the glory of Christ.



23 eite uper titou koinwnoV emoV kai eiV umaV sunergoV eite adelfoi hmwn apostoloi ekklhsiwn doxa cristou





The word messenger is apostolos in the Greek language. The transliteration is apostoloi in the Greek.



Silvanus and Timotheus

1 Thes. 1:1; 2:6 (KJV)

Paul, and Silvanus, and Timotheus, unto the church of the Thessalonians which is in God the Father and in the Lord Jesus Christ: Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.



1 pauloV kai silouanoV kai timoqeoV th ekklhsia qessalonikewn en qew patri kai kuriw ihsou cristw cariV umin kai eirhnh apo qeou patroV hmwn kai kuriou ihsou cristou





1 Thes. 2:6 (KJV)

Nor of men sought we glory, neither of you, nor yet of others, when we might have been burdensome, as the apostles of Christ.



6 oute zhtounteV ex anqrwpwn doxan oute af umwn oute ap allwn dunamenoi en barei einai wV cristou apostoloi

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What is Apostolic Succession? What is an Apostle?
Posted : 25 Feb, 2010 04:42 PM

It seems to me that the word is only capitalized and made a title because of tradition. The word angel also means messenger but the Apostles weren't called angels. In fact this word is also translated pastor.



What about 1Co 12:28 And God placed some in the assembly: firstly, apostles; secondly, prophets; thirdly, teachers; then works of power; then gifts of healing, helps, governings, kinds of languages.

1Co 12:29 Are all apostles? All prophets? All teachers? All workers of power?



It looks to me like apostles were in the church equally to prophets, teachers, etc. In fact here apostles are separate from "workers of power".



If Apostles were only commissioned by Jesus as ambassadors then what are we? Are we not also messengers and ambasadors commissioned by Christ? What about the "great commission" that everyone teaches applies to all Christians? How does that apply?



Thunder

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What is Apostolic Succession? What is an Apostle?
Posted : 26 Feb, 2010 08:04 AM

Hi Thunder and Rapio,



The first thing to understand is what is the meaning of the word "apostle". The Greek expresses it as "One who is sent" by the person who sends him/her. Anyone can be an "apostle" as it is not an office but merely a messenger sent under the authority "OF" the person who personally sent them. Let's say you are my employee and I send (apostello) you to go and deliver a message to someone. At that point you are my "apostle", an apostle "OF" Walter, until you have completed your assignment. Once you delivered the message then you are no longer an apostle. The word "OF" determines whose apostle you are, who personally sent (apostello) you.



Jesus only hand picked 13 total apostles. Judas fell. Jesus hand picked Paul, not Matthias. Matthias was picked by Peter and the other 11 Apostles, who by the way were not under the Inspiration of the Holy Spirit as He had not yet descended upon them as yet.



Paul himself made this very clear as to who picked him.

Gal 1:1 Paul, an apostle (not from men nor through man, but through Jesus Christ and God the Father who raised Him from the dead), NKJV

Notice that he said "NOT FROM MEN NOR THROUGH MAN". He is distinguishing himself as being hand picked by Jesus Christ personally. This is what qualifies him as being an apostle "OF" Jesus Christ. Had Jesus intended to pick Matthias he would have already done so while HE was here for 40 days after His resurrection. Instead Jesus waited and later hand picked Paul as His own Apostle. That is what makes Paul an Apostle "OF" Jesus Christ.



Luke 22:30 "that you may eat and drink at My table in My kingdom, and sit on thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel." NKJV.



Matthew 19:28 So Jesus said to them, "Assuredly I say to you, that in the regeneration, when the Son of Man sits on the throne of His glory, you who have followed Me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. NKJV



Jesus was talking to HIS 12 Apostles in the verses above. Jesus' comments do not apply to all Christians. That would violate the context.



So since Judas is no longer one of the 12 and there was one apostle to represent each of the 12 tribes of Israel, who then replaces Judas? There are only TWELVE (12) thrones to sit upon to judge the TWELVE tribes of Israel. It is either Matthias or Paul. Whomever CHRIST CHOSE is the determining factor as to who sits on one of those 12 thrones. Did Jesus pick Matthias? NO! Jesus picked Saul / Paul on the road to Damascus.



Rev 21:14 Now the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and on them were the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb. NKJV

How many Apostles "OF" the Lamb are there? Only Twelve.(12)

Blessings!

Walter

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What is Apostolic Succession? What is an Apostle?
Posted : 26 Feb, 2010 08:37 AM

Thanks Walter for clearing that up for me. I still wonder though who the apostles are that are in the assembly. Since this is a word that means messenger could it also mean preachers or evangelists? I am thinking that in this case Paul is not talking about the 12.



Thunder

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What is Apostolic Succession? What is an Apostle?
Posted : 26 Feb, 2010 07:44 PM

Hi Thunder,

I believe you are correct in that in the assembly the 12 were not in that group.

Regarding "evangelists and preachers". They could be apostles if they are "sent"("apostello") on a mission but the titles are not interchangeable if I understand you correctly.



I am not sure if I mentioned this in this thread but if you look at the qualifications for church "leadership" positions, which are offices, you will not find a position called "Apostle".

Blessings!

Walter

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