Author	Thread: total depravity
Admin	total depravity Posted : 9 Sep, 2009 03:40 PM Sometimes I wonder if some of you understand how offensive we are to god,and that this is the first,and absolutly nescesary step to salvation,because of the fall,we are utterly sinful,incapable of pleasing god,even after salvation,itsthe rightousness of christ that the lord sees that keeps us from judgement,yes god loves us,but not because of anything we ever do,our attitudes should be complete humility,and thankfulness,never proud or boastful,I just dont want our lord turned into some grandfatherly type person that just thinks we are so cute no matter what we do.God is perfect love,but he is also perfectly holy,and just,We need a balance in our lives,the only prayer jesus ever taught us is the lords prayer,full of reverance and thankfulness,emphasizing gods will being done,some christians ,it seems would insert the phrase my will be done, In Christ Steven Post Reply
klmartin62 View Profile History	total depravity Posted : 14 Sep, 2009 01:03 PM Sorry Brother, if it sounded like I was saying we could live any way we want and still be saved. That was not what I was trying to say. Let me start over here. When we are saved, the Holy Spirit comes to live inside of us. The Spirit then changes us. Now whether this is an instant thing, or long and drawn out is up for debate, but either way, you are changed forever. You will never be the same person you were before. The reason Paul gave us the fruits of the Spirit was so that we could test ourselves to see if we were saved. He did not say they were the fruits of the man. There is a reason for that......IF you are truly saved, the Spirit has changed you and you don't have to try to do good, you do it automatically. It is all about what is in your heart. The Pharisees thought they had it made, they followed all the laws, did everything they were supposed to do, but Jesus was not impressed. The Spirit has to guide us in the things we do, or we might as well not do them. People who force themselves to display the fruits are stuck if what is known as the "fake it till you make it" mode. I have seen this work for a few people, but very few. We have to act out of love. If we are not, it is time to hit our knees because chances are we were never saved to start with. As for God forcing us to do something.....what about Pharaoh? Or Judas? Jonah? Or my favorite, the man that tied the donkey to the rail for Jesus to ride into Jerusalem? Do you think that man could have decided that he would just stay home that day? Of course not, it was a prophesy that had to be fulfilled. It does not make sense to have complete free will and prophesy. If that were the case, there would be hundreds of unfulfilled prophesies because someone changed their minds. I think the Bible teaches clearly that God will intervene when He needs to do so. Blessings, Leon Post Reply
DontHitThatMark View Profile History	total depravity Posted : 14 Sep, 2009 02:17 PM It does make sense to have free will and prophecy...God saw everything that was going to happen on this earth before He even created it, right? He planned all this around free will. His will WILL be done no matter what because He already saw it happen. I believe He knows what needs to be done in order to save the most people through their own choice. He knew Satan would fall, He knew Adam would fall. I think that's why He decided to make this earth the first home of created beings made in His image. We were going to be special. Through Satan's sin He is going to show the universe what sin does and how much He loves us. God sent His Son to be killed for sin because He loves us. What better way to to get rid of the sin problem? Do you see His wisdom? Because of us, there will be a witness for eternity that rebellion against God is horrible. It will teach every created being that God really does have our best interests in mind. God will be vindicated. But the point is...God can see the future. He doesn't need to remove our free will to do his will. It all comes down to how much you think God loves us. Do you think He likes the worship of robots? If he was going to supersede free will, why didn't He do it with Satan before He fell? He could have reprogrammed him and no one would have noticed. No harm done. But he didn't. Because it's all about choice. We are beings with free will. That's what I believe. :peace::peace: Post Reply
View Profile History	total depravity Posted : 16 Sep, 2009 05:59 AM Your will is very important to you my friend.I would suggest that you and i are clay pots,Who can be wadded up and thrown away!Its gods will,gods power,gods glory that matter!God has created us to display his,power,glory,holiness,mercy.creation itself is gods theatre,its not about us my friend,we are finite!God saves us to make his name known(read exodus or ezekial)The god of the bible CHOSE to create adam,Chose to drown all of humanity save noah and his family,(by the way,he told noah to build the ark)God chose isreal as a nation to display his power,He CHOSE the prophets,JESUS(GOD THE SON)CHOSE his disciples.Paul,was a christian killer,who god CHOSE to spread his glory throughout the world,oops,I said world,of course i must have meant every single person who ever lived,LOL,And yes my friends he has CHOSEN his sheep!God is completly,100 percent sovereign! Those who were not chosen to salvation were passed by and left to their own evil devices and choices.It is not within the creatures jurisdiction to call into question the justice of the creator for not choosing everyone to salvation.It is enough to know that the judge of the earth has done right.It should,however,be kept in mind that if god had not graciously chosen a people for himself and sovereignly determined to provide salvation for them and apply it to them,none would be saved.The fact that he did this for some,to the exclusion of others,is in no way unfair to the latter group,unless of course one maintains that god was under obligation to provide salvation for sinners-A position wich the bible utterly rejects!!!!!!! Why would jesus be tortured and murdered if everyone was to be saved?Why wouldnt god just create the people in the saved condition? If god looked into the future and saw who would "choose salvation"and who would not,then why wouldnt he just create the the ones who would?saving jesus the agony? because we did not choose him,he chose us! and everything he does is for HIS GLORY to be displayed to his people(the ones HE chose)before the foundations of the world were laid, Dueteronomy 10;14,15 Psalm 33;12; Psalm 65;4 Psalm 106;5 haggai 2;23 matthew 11;27 matthew 22;14 matthew 24;22,24,31 luke 18;7 colossians 3;12 romans 8;28-30 titus 1;1 1 peter 1;1,2 1 peter 2;8,9 revelation 17;14 romans 8;33 ephesians 1;4 mark 13;20 revelations 13;8 IN CHRIST steven Post Reply
View Profile History	total depravity Posted : 16 Sep, 2009 06:05 AM oh,and this site was shut down for maintenance and some of my posts were miraculously removed,HMMMM,arminian administrator possibly!Thats okay,Ill keep plugging away Post Reply
DontHitThatMark View Profile History	total depravity Posted : 16 Sep, 2009 02:34 PM Yeah....it deleted mine too...and it was a really good one....*pout*... :dunce::dunce: Post Reply
View Profile History	total depravity Posted : 16 Sep, 2009 02:49 PM Well,you probably thought it was.....lolol :ROFL: In Christ Steven Post Reply
DontHitThatMark View Profile History	total depravity Posted : 16 Sep, 2009 02:50 PM It was basically saying this though... http://www.christiandatingforfree.com/forum/forum_details.php?topic_id=3186&forum_sub_cat_id=14&start=0 :peace::peace: Post Reply

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