"I didn't mention "soul" or "animals" or any "pagan" ideas. All you did what build a strawman then knock it over and proudly puff out your chest. If you want to be "real" find scripture about denying reincarnation."
End quote.
Lets try this again junior strawman. I was clear below when I gave the pagan definition to what "reincarnation' is to Rome and you are the one that honors romes definitions. AGAIN below.
"Pagan reincarnation definition - "the rebirth of a soul in a new body. A person or animal in whom a particular soul is believed to have been reborn. A new version of something from the past."
So I'm not here to discuss your Roman word of "reincarnation" because that is not found in the Bible. Perhaps you should go to an athiest site or some kind of secular medium to discuss that? This is a Christian forum but if you want to discuss resurrections, then by all means lets do that! Resurrections is all there is and "reincarnation" is not Christian but pagan!
Oh and Yahweh knows the beginning from the end of any human and how they will turn out in the end of their life!
Lets look at just one of your misunderstanding of Scripture below
Job 1:21 (KJV) 21. "And said, Naked came I out of my mother's womb, and naked shall I return thither"
So whats the point here? Nothing of a resurrection mentioned because Job is simply telling us he was naked when he was born and unto the grave/hell he will return naked! Job is speaking of his potential death, just like the young men that died when satan caused the house to fall upon them in verse 19! So I can only wonder, does Zech actually believe Job is saying he will again enter his mothers womb and have a pagan "reincarnation" to be born again as another human??? LMBO! Now let the air out of your puffed up chest there lad!
For Yahweh says, come let us reason together!
We could go on and on with the rest you posted but what would be the point, your mind is made up. So I'm thinking now, would it be wise to cast my pearls before swine?
Zech, NOW lets actually do something of merit here about our Creators clocks!
I wrote to you Zech in your thread - "FLAT EARTH people - I have questions!"
Posted : 3 Aug, 2019 07:54 PM
I asked if you would do a test.
Quote of me
I have an experiment for you to do that I did. Its nothing to do with the flat earth but it does have to do with the moon.
They tell us the moon reflects the suns light, right. I would guess you believe that?
The problem is you will have to wait for the full moon in about less than two weeks.
End quote.
You pulled a parrot distraction on me by talking about the phases of the moon, as if I didn't already know that! Lol! And even further you somehow believe the phases of the moon have something to do with the light from the sun!? Lol! So then I found an answer from you that you do indeed believe the moon reflects the suns light!
Quote below from you.
Quote - "The reflected light model works perfectly."
Solution to your statement above is a - "Thermometer Digital Laser Surface Temperature Gun" and do you own one or can you borrow one? If so then there is a full moon tonight and will be several yet to some degree for nights coming if its clear where your at in the mountains. Do the test when moon is out and shining on concrete of some kind of solid surface where there is partial shade of moon light. Check temp in direct moon light and then in the shade and tell us what the difference in temp is between the two different locations.
**WHAT WILL TAKE PLACE AT THE SECOND COMING OF OUR GREAT GOD AND SAVIOR JESUS CHRIST APPEARS ON THE LAST DAY**??
Colossians 3:4: When Christ, who is your life **APPEARS**, then **YOU** {**CHURCH SAINTS**} also will **APPEAR** with Him in glory.”
I John 3:2,3: “When Jesus **APPEARS**, **WE** {**CHURCH SAINTS**} shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is. Everyone who has this hope in Him purifies himself, just as He is pure!!”
I Peter 5:4: “When the Chief Shepherd **APPEARS**, **YOU** {**CHURCH SAINTS**} will receive the crown of glory that will never fade away!”
I Peter 1:13: Therefore, with minds are alert and fully sober, **SET YOUR HOPE** on the grace to be brought to you when **JESUS CHRIST IS REVEALED AT HIS SECOND COMING**!
I Corinthians 15:48-52: As was the earthly man, so are those who are of the earth, and as is the heavenly man, so are those who are of heaven. And just as we have borne the image of the earthly man, so shall we ** BEAR THE IMAGE OF THE MAN FROM HEAVEN! I declare to you that **FLESH AND BLOOD CANNOT INHERIT THE KINGDOM OF GOD**. Listen I tell you a mystery: We shall not all sleep, but **WE **ALL** WILL BE CHANGED**--in a flash in a twinkling of an eye, at the **LAST** TRUMPET, for the trumpet will sound, the dead will be **RAISED IMPERISHABLE, and **WE WILL BE CHANGED**. For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and the mortal with **IMMORTALITY**!!
I Corinthians 15:22-24: For as in Adam all die, so in Christ **ALL** WILL BE MADE ALIVE**. But each in his own turn: Christ, the Firstfruits; **THEN WHEN HE COMES** those who belong to Him. **THEN THE **END** WILL COME** {Not 1260 days later!!}, when He hands over the Kingdom to God the Father!!
I Thessalonians 4:16,17; 5:2,4: For the Lord Himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel {See Rev 14:15} and with the **TRUMPET**{See Matt 24:30 & Rev 11:15,18 & I Cor 15:52} call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the **CLOUDS** {See Matt 24:30 and Rev 14:14} to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord **FOREVER**!
Matthew 24:29-31: Jesus says, "Immediately after the distress of those {1260} days the sun will be darkened, and the stars will fall from the sky {Luke 21:28 adds: "When these things begin to take place, stand up and lift up your heads, because your redemption is drawing near!!"} At that time the sign of the Son of Man coming on the **CLOUDS** {See I Thess 4:17} of the sky, with power and great glory. And He will send His angels with a loud **TRUMPET** {See I Cor 15:52 & I Thess 4::16 & Rev 11:15,18} call an they will gather His **ELECT** {See Rom 11:5-7; 2 Tim 2:10 & Titus 1:1!} from the 4 winds, from one end of the heavens to the other!" {Mark 13:27 adds: "From the ends of the earth."}
Daniel 12:1,2,7b: There will be a time of distress such as has not happened from the beginning of nations to then. But at that time your people--everyone whose name is found in the {Lamb's} Book will be delivered. Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth well awake, some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt.
Matthew 25:31-34,41,46: Jesus says, "When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him {See Matt 24:29-31; I Thess 4:16,17; 2 Thess 1:6-10}, He will sit on His glorious throne. All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. He will put the sheep on His right and the goats on His left. *THEN** the King will say to those on His right, 'Come, you who ar blessed by My father; take your inheritance, the Kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world... **THEN** He will say to those on His left, 'Depart from Me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared fror the devil and his angels'...**THEN** they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life!"
2 Thess 1:1,6-10: ‘To the *CHURCH* of the Thessalonians…God is just; He will pay back trouble to those who trouble you and give relief to you who are troubled, and to us as well. This will happen *WHEN* the Lord Jesus is **REVEALED** from heaven in blazing fire with His powerful angels {See Matt 24:30-31 above!}. He will punish those who do not know God and do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. They will be punished with everlasting destruction and shut out from the presence of the Lord **ON THE DAY HE COMES** to be glorified in His holy people {**CHURCH SAINTS**}!! This includes **YOU** {Thessalonian **CHURCH SAINTS**}
So here we see that the Resurrection of the saved and the lost will be Resurrected on the **SAME DAY** when Jesus Christ is **REVEALED** from heaven with His powerful angels!!
John 6:39,44: Jesus says, "And this is the will of Him who sent Me that I shall lose none of all that He has given Me {God's **ELECT**}, but raise them up at the **LAST DAY**... No one can come to Me **UNLESS** the Father **DRAWS** him, and I will raise him {**GOD'S ELECT**} up at the **LAST DAY**!"
John 12:48: Jesus says, "There is a Judge for the one who rejects Me and does not accept My words, that very word which I spoke will condemn him at the {**SAME**}**LAST DAY**!"
Your accusations concerning Roman ideas is largely non-sequitur because modern Christianity is Roman. You somehow think you are a free thinker when you only read and follow an approved Roman Bible. You stringently adhere to the Book Rome complied and to 3rd and 4th century traditional Roman systematic interpretations. I'm the one going outside to extra Biblical extant ancient writings such as Vedic, Egyptian and Sumerian Texts. The idea of Reincarnation was in Israel before, during and after the time of Jesus. Your post is so nonsensical that it would be like trying to answer a person insisting 2 + 2 = a bird.
Btw, you misinterpret the results of the laser experiment because you apparently don't understand about radiated heat.
**WHAT WILL TAKE PLACE AT THE SECOND COMING OF OUR GREAT GOD AND SAVIOR JESUS CHRIST APPEARS ON THE LAST DAY**??
Colossians 3:4: When Christ, who is your life **APPEARS**, then **YOU** {**CHURCH SAINTS**} also will **APPEAR** with Him in glory.”
I John 3:2,3: “When Jesus **APPEARS**, **WE** {**CHURCH SAINTS**} shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is. Everyone who has this hope in Him purifies himself, just as He is pure!!”
I Peter 5:4: “When the Chief Shepherd **APPEARS**, **YOU** {**CHURCH SAINTS**} will receive the crown of glory that will never fade away!”
I Peter 1:13: Therefore, with minds are alert and fully sober, **SET YOUR HOPE** on the grace to be brought to you when **JESUS CHRIST IS REVEALED AT HIS SECOND COMING**!
I Corinthians 15:48-52: As was the earthly man, so are those who are of the earth, and as is the heavenly man, so are those who are of heaven. And just as we have borne the image of the earthly man, so shall we ** BEAR THE IMAGE OF THE MAN FROM HEAVEN! I declare to you that **FLESH AND BLOOD CANNOT INHERIT THE KINGDOM OF GOD**. Listen I tell you a mystery: We shall not all sleep, but **WE **ALL** WILL BE CHANGED**--in a flash in a twinkling of an eye, at the **LAST** TRUMPET, for the trumpet will sound, the dead will be **RAISED IMPERISHABLE, and **WE WILL BE CHANGED**. For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and the mortal with **IMMORTALITY**!!
I Corinthians 15:22-24: For as in Adam all die, so in Christ **ALL** WILL BE MADE ALIVE**. But each in his own turn: Christ, the Firstfruits; **THEN WHEN HE COMES** those who belong to Him. **THEN THE **END** WILL COME** {Not 1260 days later!!}, when He hands over the Kingdom to God the Father!!
I Thessalonians 4:16,17; 5:2,4: For the Lord Himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel {See Rev 14:15} and with the **TRUMPET**{See Matt 24:30 & Rev 11:15,18 & I Cor 15:52} call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the **CLOUDS** {See Matt 24:30 and Rev 14:14} to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord **FOREVER**!
Matthew 24:29-31: Jesus says, "Immediately after the distress of those {1260} days the sun will be darkened, and the stars will fall from the sky {Luke 21:28 adds: "When these things begin to take place, stand up and lift up your heads, because your redemption is drawing near!!"} At that time the sign of the Son of Man coming on the **CLOUDS** {See I Thess 4:17} of the sky, with power and great glory. And He will send His angels with a loud **TRUMPET** {See I Cor 15:52 & I Thess 4::16 & Rev 11:15,18} call an they will gather His **ELECT** {See Rom 11:5-7; 2 Tim 2:10 & Titus 1:1!} from the 4 winds, from one end of the heavens to the other!" {Mark 13:27 adds: "From the ends of the earth."}
Daniel 12:1,2,7b: There will be a time of distress such as has not happened from the beginning of nations to then. But at that time your people--everyone whose name is found in the {Lamb's} Book will be delivered. Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth well awake, some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt.
Matthew 25:31-34,41,46: Jesus says, "When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him {See Matt 24:29-31; I Thess 4:16,17; 2 Thess 1:6-10}, He will sit on His glorious throne. All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. He will put the sheep on His right and the goats on His left. *THEN** the King will say to those on His right, 'Come, you who ar blessed by My father; take your inheritance, the Kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world... **THEN** He will say to those on His left, 'Depart from Me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels'...**THEN** they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life!"
2 Thess 1:1,6-10: ‘To the *CHURCH* of the Thessalonians…God is just; He will pay back trouble to those who trouble you and give relief to you who are troubled, and to us as well. This will happen *WHEN* the Lord Jesus is **REVEALED** from heaven in blazing fire with His powerful angels {See Matt 24:30-31 above!}. He will punish those who do not know God and do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. They will be punished with everlasting destruction and shut out from the presence of the Lord **ON THE DAY HE COMES** to be glorified in His holy people {**CHURCH SAINTS**}!! This includes **YOU** {Thessalonian **CHURCH SAINTS**}
So here we see that the Resurrection of the saved and the lost will be Resurrected on the **SAME DAY** when Jesus Christ is **REVEALED** from heaven with His powerful angels!!
John 6:39,44: Jesus says, "And this is the will of Him who sent Me that I shall lose none of all that He has given Me {God's **ELECT**}, but raise them up at the **LAST DAY**... No one can come to Me **UNLESS** the Father **DRAWS** him, and I will raise him {**GOD'S ELECT**} up at the **LAST DAY**!"
John 12:48: Jesus says, "There is a Judge for the one who rejects Me and does not accept My words, that very word which I spoke will condemn him at the {**SAME**}**LAST DAY**!"
Revelation 22:16,16,19: "I, Jesus, have sent My angel to give you this testimony for the churches.... I warn everyone who reads the words of this prophecy of this book. If anyone**ADDS** {Like KJVonly} anything to them, God will add to them all the plagues described in this book {Including eternal torment in hell in Rev 14:9-11}. And if anyone **TAKES WORDS AWAY** {Like KJVonly} from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him any share in the Tree of Life and in the Holy City {The New Jerusalem}, which are described in this book!!"
The Preterists like KJVonly teach that everyone of these Second Coming promises took place in AD 70 which is an unpardonable sin of **ADDING** or **TAKING WORDS AWAY** from the prophecies in Revelation!. May we all pray that KJVonly will publically repent of these sins and that God may forgive her and then she will be able to sit with Jesus on His throne and that Jesus will give her a **WONDERFUL NEW NAME** known only by Jesus and her as per Rev 2:17 and Rev 3:21!!
I'm the one going outside to extra Biblical extant ancient writings such as Vedic, Egyptian and Sumerian Texts.
End quote
I used to go with extra biblical also once, Jubilees, book of Enoch, etc. until I started to realize it was replacing unknown truth with truth of the Bible. It was confusion for me.
Between 1947 and 1956 approximately 15 Jubilees scrolls were found in five caves at Qumran, all written in Hebrew. The large number of manuscripts (more than for any biblical books except for Psalms, Deuteronomy, Isaiah, Exodus, and Genesis, in descending order) indicates that Jubilees was widely used at Qumran.
The Book of Enoch was considered as scripture in the Epistle of Barnabas (16:4) and by many of the early Church Fathers, such as Athenagoras, Clement of Alexandria, Irenaeus and Tertullian, who wrote c. 200 that the Book of Enoch had been rejected by the Jews because it contained prophecies pertaining to Christ.
And see , this is why! Because it was Alexandrain ! What our modern so called bibles are translated from!!!
No one wants to have their eyes open to truth! Some modern bibles are corrupt! Do you read the Egyptian book of the dead also Zech? (sighs) You have some mystical type of religion I feel. I got another post coming for you. It got erased yesterday ..an hours worth of work!
It is the Spirit promised by Jesus which guides into all truth.
However...........
If you'd rather believe the Roman Catholic Church of the 4th century telling the world truth is only found in the Books they have approved to read - well..... that's your choice, but at least be honest about it.
Truth is Truth no matter where it comes from, the Spirit discerns.
To the Biblically ignorant reader, the Book of Enoch might have an appeal; but to a believer grounded in the Scriptures, the Book of Enoch is packed full of heresy. For example:
We read in chapter 40 of the Book of Enoch...
1 And after that I saw thousands of thousands and ten thousand times ten thousand, I saw a multitude
2 beyond number and reckoning, who stood before the Lord of Spirits. And on the four sides of the Lord of Spirits I saw four presences, different from those that sleep not, and I learnt their names: for the angel that went with me made known to me their names, and showed me all the hidden things.
3 And I heard the voices of those four presences as they uttered praises before the Lord of glory.
4 The first voice blesses the Lord of Spirits for ever and ever.
5 And the second voice I heard blessing
6 the Elect One and the elect ones who hang upon the Lord of Spirits. And the third voice I heard pray and intercede for those who dwell on the earth and supplicate in the name of the Lord of Spirits.
7 And I heard the fourth voice fending off the Satans and forbidding them to come before the Lord
8 of Spirits to accuse them who dwell on the earth. After that I asked the angel of peace who went with me, who showed me everything that is hidden: ‘Who are these four presences which I have
9 seen and whose words I have heard and written down?’ And he said to me: ‘This first is Michael, the merciful and long-suffering: and the second, who is set over all the diseases and all the wounds of the children of men, is Raphael: and the third, who is set over all the powers, is Gabriel: and the fourth, who is set over the repentance unto hope of those who inherit eternal life, is named Phanuel.’ 10 And these are the four angels of the Lord of Spirits and the four voices I heard in those days.
The Bible never mentions an angel named Phanuel, let alone an angel who is set over the repentance of those who inherit eternal life. What blasphemy! That statement in itself contradicts everything the Word of God teaches. We read in 1st Timothy 2:5 that Jesus Christ is the ONLY Mediator between God and men, not some angel named Phanuel... "For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus." Repentance is strictly between a man and Jesus Christ alone. Only Jesus died for our sins, and shed His blood to pay for them (1st Peter 1:18-19); therefore, we must be diligent to guard and defend against LIARS and imposters who would lead people to believe otherwise. 1st John 2:22 clearly indicts all Christ-deniers as LIARS, guilty before God.
Here's Enoch chapter 48:1-3...
1 And in that place I saw the fountain of righteousness Which was inexhaustible: And around it were many fountains of wisdom: And all the thirsty drank of them, And were filled with wisdom, And their dwellings were with the righteous and holy and elect. 2 And at that hour that Son of Man was named In the presence of the Lord of Spirits, And his name before the Head of Days. 3 Yea, before the sun and the signs were created, Before the stars of the heaven were made, His name was named before the Lord of Spirits.
Was the Son of Man named? When was Jesus named in Heaven? This is an attack on the deity of Jesus. Jesus Himself claimed in Revelation 1:8, "I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty." Jesus is Eternal, without beginning or end. Head of Days? Lord of Spirits? These terms are NOT found in the Bible. IF the Book of Enoch were valid, composing well over 100 chapters, there should be numerous New Testament references to it; but there aren't. Although some people claim that the Bible quotes the Book of Enoch over 100 times, this is simply not true. Just as the Qur'an, the Book of Enoch borrows from the Word of God. In sharp contrast to the Book of Enoch, the New Testament often quotes the Book of Genesis.
We read in the Book of Enoch, chapter 69:8-12...
8 ...And the fourth was named Penemue: he taught the
9 children of men the bitter and the sweet, and he taught them all the secrets of their wisdom. And he instructed mankind in writing with ink and paper, and thereby many sinned from eternity to
10 eternity and until this day. For men were not created for such a purpose, to give confirmation
11 to their good faith with pen and ink. For men were created exactly like the angels, to the intent that they should continue pure and righteous, and death, which destroys everything, could not have taken hold of them, but through this their knowledge they are perishing, and through this power
12 it is consuming me.
What ... man's wisdom came from a demon named Penemue? That's crazy! Did ink and paper cause the fall of the human race? Whoa ... I'd better through all my fine-point pens away immediately! It was Adam's sin that brought sin into the world (Romans 5:12); not evil literature. Mankind is inherently evil of himself, prone to the works of the flesh (Galatians 5:19-21). The Charismatics (Pentecostals) give far too much credit to demons for the sinful actions of men. They believe that every sin a person commits is evidence of demon-possession. That is absurd! Men and women sin because they are sinners! (Romans 3:10,23).
Although demons definitely influence mankind to do evil, the ultimate decision is OURS. The Devil cannot force anyone to sin. People need to stop blaming demons and the Devil for their sins, and start looking into the mirror. God has promised to help His children live right... "There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it" (1st Corinthians 10:13). No excuses!
"To the Biblically ignorant reader, the Book of Enoch might have an appeal; but to a believer grounded in the Scriptures...."
Translation:
If you are ignorant and ungrounded in the Books the Roman Catholic Church picked out for you to read in the 4th century, burning all others then you might find some value in the Book of Enoch.
