I want to have a discussion on freewill. How come Jonah didn't have a choice on going to Ninevah to preach? Some might say that it was his destiny to go and preach. Then my question is: did He have a free will? This question is just to start a discussion.
I am familiar with the teachings of Dake, and will not argue about it, mainly because of the confusion it could cause many. I will say that I disagree because each of the scriptures used to present your arguments could easily be interpreted in a more traditional sense.
Christian guy,
Very well explained points. It is obvious that you have studied this subject in depth. Just wanted to add that the theme of Romans 9 actually starts in Romans 8:29. Great post.
Great posts and I will respond to them soon but I am contrained with time over the next couple of days due to doing some construction work at my Church. I have asked the adminsitration if they would consider working on getting these boards to allow us to have the ability to use different fonts, colors etc., as it makes it easier to present the scriptures when we can highlight and embolden words and phrases. It would also be nice to be able to use the Greek fonts as well.
Finis Jennings Dake is the author of several books and an annotated Bible that teaches the theology you are speaking of here. He is credited with this theology, even though most of it existed in various places prior to his writings. He was, I believe, the first to ever put them all together in one format. The Dake Bible has been referred to as The Pentecostal Study Bible. I owned one at one time, before passing it on to someone who believed along those lines. I am too much of a literalist to believe along those lines. If I am not mistaken, these beliefs started in the 1950's with his putting them all in one book.
Wow, this is a great subject, & a great discussion guys!
And the use of Jonahs mission as a starting point for the
discussion is very interesting too, because I think that it
is a subject that actually presents both points of view.
It seems to me that Jonah had absolutely no free will in it..
But the Ninevites actually did have a free will, & they chose
an option that wasnt even presented to them by Jonah or Yahweh.
Jonah didnt go to Ninevah to preach to them...And I cant even
find the slightest indication that he even presented a typical
"Repent or Perish" Message to them...He simply told them that
they Would Be Destroyed in 40 Days...but they repented instead.
And of course Jonah was upset..he had become a "false prophet".
And yet he himself figured that they would repent, & be saved.
And these people (that he just helped save) were on the verge
of invading & destroying his Israel-so he felt like a treasonist.
So the simple conclusion/moral of this story might be that the
only Free Will we have is torwards accepting or rejecting Yahweh.
But once we are His then we are Bondslaves to Him & we no longer
have personal Free Will..except in the sense that our constant
prayer should always be to Do His Will, Which Is Our Will Too.
If that makes any sense?!? If not then listen to this passage:
Rom 9:16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that shewth mercy.
Rom 9:17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.
Rom 9:18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.
Rom 9:19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?
Rom 9:20 Nay but, man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?
Rom 9:21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
Rom 9:22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:
Rom 9:23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
Rom 9:24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also the Gentiles?
I actually have a lot more to say about this whole subject of freewill vs. predestination but thats all I have time for now.
