Thinking about Cattle's situation and the battle that he is facing with this site or perhaps some individuals on this site I'm curious on where you draw the line. By that I mean, where do you draw the line when someone says something that goes strongly against with what you believe. I think as Christians we have the desire to stand up for the Word of God but with so many variations in the understanding of the Word of God how can we "debate" with others what the Word really says without coming across hateful or insulting. I mean, if I don't agree with something someone says, they could take it as an insult to their intelligence. I know that the purposeful use of derogatory comments is not appropriate but where to you draw the line in defending what you believe to be true and yet being considerate of others' feelings. One thing that I think the church has done too much of lately is being tolerant of worldly things and ideas. I don't think that tolerance to a misguided thought on the Word of God is a good thing, so again...where do you draw the line? God Bless!!
Right here ! Right now !...The persons that use the Word of GOD ta Teardown instead of Buildup...well...Lord says ta Luv thy Enemies...OK...but he never said I gota like em...Lord says turn the other cheek...OK...only got two face cheeks ta slap...after that...well...Lord says turn from them an wipe the dust from yer feet an move on...
Lord told me I dont havta prove HIS word...He has already done that...I jus gota LOVE...an sometimes...LOVE hurts...xo
Can anyone tell me where in the Bible God tells us to tolerate false doctrine or false teachings from anyone who comes to us with ANOTHER GOSPEL? Did not the apostle speak out against those who were suppose to be disciples following with them, but move away with their own doctrine? And if you read Pauls writing and the book of Acts, I don't think their words were so loving, but were straight forward, up close and personal, to the point.
It seems to me that even Jesus harshly rebuked the Phraisees and Peter when they spoke out of terms to His truths. and the apostles were always confronting false teachers and false doctrines, and each other with words that weren't too pleasant and can be found throughout the Bible. God says to have compassion on a person who is without knowledge of the truth, in correcting them, and if a person is ignorant let him/her be ignorant. So, is this a sin and insulting to use the word ignorance just because this is a Christian site, yet Paul and Jesus and throughout all the New Testament he speaks about those who are without knowledge of the truth as being ignorant... duh!
So why is it that you're finding what Gary is saying to be insulting and un Christian-like, and should not be said on a forum site, just because its a Christian site? But Jesus, Paul Peter, James, Jude, and others have strict spoken with firm words to those who teach a false doctrine. I suppose they would be considered unChristian-like if they were on this forum as well...:zzzz:
Does not God call us to speak in Holy Boldness with use of scripture to those who speak falsely about God and His word? And did not Jesus and the apostles do so with the word of God? Jesus told his disciples that He wished offenses would not come, but they are sure to come... and there is no way around it."
So what are Believers suppose to do? STAND AND TAKE AUTHORITY OVER THE TRICKS OF THE DEVIL, AND REBUKE, REPROOF, CORRECT AND INSTRUCT those who are without, in order to save a soul. This ain't no game! This warefare! And its obvious our brother is under attach with a twisted message of what he thinks he knows about God and His word. So, what needs to be done is for everyone to put on the whole armor of God and go into spiritual warfare for our brother, for we are not fighting against flesh and blood, but against principalities, and powers, and rulers of darkness of this generation, and against spiritual wickedness in high places, that are trying to capture the mind. Being spiritual minded, eliminates being insulted and being offended at what anyone has to say, because spiritual discernment lets you know right off that he's under attach, and as believers we're to fight FOR HIM, NOT against him. So examine yoursleves and see if you be spiritual minded or personal minded focusing on your feelings.
PAULS SAYS if a brother/sister comes speaking something that is contray to what the gospel says, we are to do what?... REBUKE HARSHLY, REPROOF, INSTRUCT, AND CORRECT WITH THE WORD OF GOD! And he sure didn't speak kind word of love to the Church at Corinthin or Peter or the others he rebuked and reproved. So waaaassssup with you people... why are you so offended with what Gary is saying which is nothing to be offended by, he is without understanding. So is what he is saying a sin or what?. God has given us everything we need to know about how to fight the good fight of faith as good soldiers against those who do not know the truth and misintrepret His truths, and the power of darkness and wickedness. I ask all of you where is your weapon of warfare and your whole armor of God? No one is curssing so what's the problem here?...
Jude tells us to CONTEND FOR THE FAITH BY WHICH WE ALL HAVE BEEN DELIVERED.. So is CONTEND as sweet loving word of gentleness? Or is it a word meaning to fight and take a stand against those who come up against what you know to be true. Paul tells us that a person who does not hear the truth is subverted, which means to be wraped and preverted, so is this not to be said on this "CHRISTIAN SITE?"... tip toeing through the tuplits with no defense with the word of God? geeezzzz!
I sure hate to see when the time comes for the anitchrist and his follwers. What are you going to do, when others attack with hateful words and physical violance during the coming times of our Lord?..speak to them in love without rebuke or fighting back?... I don't think so! Even Jesus fought back with stiff words calling the Pharisees, and Paul called the false techers who would listen to his teachings whitewash tombs. I'm not speaking that we should call names, but my Lord, what in the world is wrong with speaking out what the Bible has to say about false teachers and false doctrine, and it sure ain't nice.
False doctrine and false teachers effect the faith of many believers and especially those who are the lost and or the weak Christian, and it is the responsibility of strong Christian to protect the faith and God's word by speaking out in holy boldness against such, or either dissociate oursleves from a person who is not speaking the truth in an effort to try to learn the truth, but is trying to convience us that what they speak is God's truth, when we know better.
SOOOOO, WHERE DO YOU DRAW THE LINE? Contend for the faith WITH THE WORD OF TRUTH, and the line will surely be drawn, take a stand. For the kingdom of God suffers violence, and the violence take it by what? FORCE! I'm very glad to know that Jesus isis going to kick satan's behind when he comes and you can bet He will not be doing this in brotherly love, but in the war .:peace:
You make several valid points but this site is not the church. This is a dating site and a place to make friends whether or not they are Christians. There are many people here who do not have a thorough knowledge of the Truth nor do they understand the deep things of the Scriptures. Because all denominations are represented here and a variety of views on Truth as well, we need to be as wise as serpents and gentle as doves at the same time as we are told in the Bible. I see these forums as pa place where we can share our beliefs and various viewpoints but it is not a place to declare war on someone who has a different version of the Truth.
It is possible to discuss our differences without insulting each other or our denominations, to speak wisely without starting a fight and we can be friendly about it. The place for defending the Truth and standing up for it is in our churches and in the world. A place designed for social interaction like this site is not that place. What's more taking the Kingdom by force has nothing to do with us being forceful in overcoming the world. In every sense of the word good overcomes evil and love overcomes hate. THe only thing that argumentative Christians do for Christianity is give it a bad name.
The impression I receive from your response is that we should sharply rebuke those who follow false doctrine. While I agree that we should be alert for those who preach these false doctrines, I don't think that's how we should go about it. To back up your view, you say that Jesus did this. Well... frankly, He has the authority to do this. Did you notice how the teachers of the law always asked about His authority to do miracles and to rebuke others? That's why He was able to cut to the point. Even then, He had a gentleness about Him. We aren't able to do this because we have all fallen short of the glory of God. We have planks in our eyes. Jesus didn't. In fact, scripture tells us how to win over unbelievers. It is with gentleness and patience:
Proverbs 25:15
Titus 3:2
James 3:17
2 Timothy 2:24-25
Galatians 6:1
Proverbs 15:1
Ephesians 4:2
(sorry for not typing these out. Lot of typing. lol. As always, I encourage you to read beyond and before the verses listed to get a fuller understanding)
I understand what you're saying, and I don't want you or anyone else to miss what I'm saying about it being the responsibility of ALL believer's to take a stand for righteousness, and fight against opposition, and those who soeak swelling words against the teaching of the Doctrine of Christ which forms, and is the foundations of Christian beliefs, this is biblical and it is found throughout the Bible, and expected. Especially, if the person says he/she is a christian... you either defend God's word of truth, or keep silent.
I realize we are on a dating website, and it deson't matter where you are if there is a need to take a stand. You stated that this is not a church. Well, as believers in Jesus Christ, we are the church, a church in not just defined as a building, because wherever two or three are gather in the name of Christ in fellowship, whether its on this internet site, in the park , on a bus, or in the marketplace, or mall, or wherever. Christ says He is in our company, because we are the body of Christ, we are the church.
The church building is only the place we are are exhorted to go to worship and honor and praise in oneness before our Lord, get instructions, gather in fellwoship one with another, and gather information. And this biblical discussion section of this social dating site, becomes the place where believers gather and meet to fellwoship one with another, and try and get spiritual instructions and information, learn from each other, and discuss what we THINK we know about our Lord. And in reality it is a form of worship honoring our Lord thus, this section of this forum becomes the church, because it becomes the spot where the nonbelievers and believers (church) are meeting. and where we, as believers try to apply those instructions we have learned in the church building into all the world.
So really, it doesn't matter where we take a stand, or draw the line, and it is has nothing to do with being in a building which we called a church... if we're on a boat, in the park, on the streets, in a car, or wherever if we are dealing with a person who oppose Christ's teachings we become the church, and we must defend the word of God and His name, because we are HIS BODY. Just as you would defend your family if someone spoke out against them, doesn't matter the place, any place is a good place to declare war against a lie, when we're speaking God's truth. And there is only One TRUTH, and it is found in the Doctrine of Christ which is the Christian foundation. And I can't speak for you or anyone else, but I will always defend God's TRUTHS which are the teachings in the Holy Bible upon which stands my Christins faith.
I've been on this site for about 3 years, and I'm very much aware of the diversity of people, denominations, faiths, cultures, beliefs, and unbeliefs, and religions on this site. The problem is, the Doctrine of Christian teachings are not being opposed by anyone outside the Christian faith, or from another denomination, faith, or religious belief. But it is being opposed by a brother who claim, professes and confesses to being a Christian, who believes in the Lord Jesus Christ. Hope you see the difference. And according to the rebuke Paul gave Peter, this person ahould also be rebuked and reprooved, corrected, and instructed in the proper things of the Lord.
Also, I will say this, if in a discussion or debate which is mostly what Ive seen in this biblical discussion section of the forum, debates, which is also good. Therefore, if it is as you express that believers are to practice loving kindness in discussions, then my question to you and the others: Why is everyone upset? If love is so abiding in YOUR hearts, and the other person is not abiding in this christian love in the discussion, would not the love in your hearts cover a multitude of sin?.. I'm just saying. If love covers a multitude of sins, then you would find no reasons to feel insulted no matter what another person has to say.... make sense to me:hearts:
So, then, let your LOVE abide, and no one will find a need to feel insulted, when offenses come, if this forum is not the right place to draw the line or take a stand. Then where is the right place. I would have to say if this is not the place that would be a great missed opportunity for witnessing into all the world, wherein this site goes...
Oh yeah,.... you state parts of the scripture in Matthew which says, to be wise as serpents and gentle as doves. Jesus warns the disciples and all of believers in Matthew chapter10 ,of this very point i am speaking about, when He tells them "Look, I send you out as sheep in the midst of wolves, you therefore, be wise as serpents, and harmless as doves.' The warning is for us to always be on the look out because opposition is going to come, and we must always be ready to give an answer to anyone who question our hope, and just as a serpent in charaterbe wise and know when stricks, take a stand.
Jesus warns that we will come up against those (wolves)who will attack us and who will hate us and speak evil things about us, but we are to make sure in our teaching or spreading the good new about Jesus, we are not the ones who start the fight. We re to be wise in understanding who is behind the conflict, and make sure we're not starting the problems. We're are to be mild and gentle as a dove and not harm anyone, and not resist when other harm us, becaue te Holy Spirit is our defens. Reading of the comple chapter will better put this in order... the people rushed to know the wor of truth John preached, and when we speak god's word of truth many will be saved, even those who speak against the christin faith.
Again, if LOVE as a dove is abiding and is the order of the day against opposition, then no one should find offense in nothing Gary has posted... after all LOVE COVERS A MULTITUDE OF SIN. AND LOVE, as a gentle sweet dove, WILL OVERLOOK OFFENSES AND OPPOSITION!
I must laugh to myself, this is long, but herenecessary:hearts::angel::zzzz: LOL
Garrett, I will get back to your comments later. I must make a move at tis time. I spent more time than I thought I would responding to Thunder's post.
I'll get back with you, becuase I would like to take a look with you as to why you think we as believrs don't have power to rebuke, reproof, correct or instruct anyone in opposition. And that Jesus is the only one who could do this.
Your comment confuses mebit, and I'm not seeking to start a discussion about this, but we do have the power to stand against oppostion.
We can take a stand and share our beliefs without blasting someone else. I think that's the idea everyone is trying to get across. A forum isn't a place for "YOU'RE WRONG! HERESY!"...it's for discussion...so it might be more like "This is what I believe" or "What do you think about this verse". And I do think Jesus had a little more authority than we do to rebuke people....considering He kinda wrote the bible...and you know...is GOD. So unless you're without sin, don't cast the first stone...don't strain a gnat and swallow a camel...don't try to get a speck out....eh...you get the idea. Share your beliefs, but don't pretend you're perfect.
