Author Thread: Is this Gog and Magog and the man of sin?
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Is this Gog and Magog and the man of sin?
Posted : 19 Dec, 2019 05:02 PM

Some may say, Well, this wasn't in my Bible..

But take a look at this verse and ask yourself why Claudius is mentioned and why are there SO many books on Rome?

Do you think Claudius is mentioned as a clue for us to dig deeper into this historical puzzle???

Acts 18:2

King James Version

2 And found a certain Jew named Aquila, born in Pontus, lately come from Italy, with his wife Priscilla; (because that Claudius had commanded all Jews to depart from Rome:) and came unto them.

The persecution that arose over Stephen lasted three and a half years, or one thousand two hundred and sixty days (A.D. 34-38) (Rev.12:6, 14); it collapsed with the removal of Caiaphas from the high priesthood; Pilate’s leaving Judaea, and the conversion of St. Paul. This is represented by the earth opening its mouth to swallow the flood of persecution pouring out of the dragon’s mouth. (Rev. 12:16) It is also symbolized by the beast receiving a mortal wound to one of its heads. (Rev. 13:3)

In receiving the mortal wound to its head, the beast lost the power to persecute and symbolically went down in death to the bottomless pit . (Rev. 11:7; 17:8) The dragon, which gave the beast power, also went down to the bottomless pit. (Rev. 20:1, 2) Both the dragon and beast remained in the bottomless pit for a period symbolized by a thousand years. (Rev. 11:7; 17:8; 20:7)

Claudius was the “angel” that bound the dragon. (Rev. 20:1) All during Claudius’ reign the church enjoyed the protection of law; even banishing Jews from Rome for rioting against the church. (Acts 18:2) St. Paul alludes to Claudius in his second epistle to the Thessalonians as “he who lets” (restrains). (II Thess. 2:6, 7) The persecution of the last day would not come so long as Claudius was upon the throne, repressing the mystery of iniquity and powers of persecution. When Claudius was taken out of the way, Nero would be revealed as the man of sin and son of perdition, and the church would be gathered in martyrdom unto Christ. John portrays this by the dragon and beast being loosed from the bottomless pit and the mortal wound to the beast’s head having healed. John described the beast in Rev. 17:8 as the beast that “was and is not and is about to ascend out of the bottomless pit.” That is, the persecuting power of the empire that suffered defeat by the collapse of the persecution over St. Stephen was about to manifest itself again, this time under Nero, whose name the beast bore. This is the point at which the battle of Gog and Magog begins:

the adversary in this case was world civil power embodied in Rome, Nero, and the Jews. In Rome, the beast was identified with Nero, who was its driving power (Rev. 13:1-10); in Asia and other parts of the empire, the Jews, at the behest of their leaders in Jerusalem, were the driving force. John portrays this by a harlot, riding the beast in a surfeit of blood and gore. (Rev. 17:3-6) In Palestine, the persecution was driven by the “false prophet,” the religious leaders of the Jews who bade them to make an inquisition against the church like unto the beast’s. (Rev. 13:11-18) The dragon and beast make war against the church by surrounding the “camp of the saints” (the church). But fire comes down from God out of heaven and consumes Gog and his host, and the dragon, beast, and false prophet are cast into the lake of fire. (Rev. 19:20, 21; 20:9, 10) The harlot is also consumed. (Rev. 18) An angel calls to the birds of heaven to come and devour the carcasses of the slain. (Rev. 19:17, 18; cf. Ezek. 39:17) Following the world-wide devastations of the last days, God renews the earth, in which the church reigns supreme with Christ. (Rev. 21, 22)

.The name Nero is proverbial for murder, rape, sodomy, incest, cruelty, and every kind of crime imaginable.

The persecution that arose over Stephen lasted three and a half years, or one thousand two hundred and sixty days (A.D. 34-38) (Rev.12:6, 14); it collapsed with the removal of Caiaphas from the high priesthood; Pilate’s leaving Judaea, and the conversion of St. Paul. This is represented by the earth opening its mouth to swallow the flood of persecution pouring out of the dragon’s mouth. (Rev. 12:16) It is also symbolized by the beast receiving a mortal wound to one of its heads. (Rev. 13:3)

In receiving the mortal wound to its head, the beast lost the power to persecute and symbolically went down in death to the bottomless pit . (Rev. 11:7; 17:8) The dragon, which gave the beast power, also went down to the bottomless pit. (Rev. 20:1, 2) Both the dragon and beast remained in the bottomless pit for a period symbolized by a thousand years. (Rev. 11:7; 17:8; 20:7)

Claudius was the “angel” that bound the dragon. (Rev. 20:1) All during Claudius’ reign the church enjoyed the protection of law; even banishing Jews from Rome for rioting against the church. (Acts 18:2) St. Paul alludes to Claudius in his second epistle to the Thessalonians as “he who lets” (restrains). (II Thess. 2:6, 7) The persecution of the last day would not come so long as Claudius was upon the throne, repressing the mystery of iniquity and powers of persecution. When Claudius was taken out of the way, Nero would be revealed as the man of sin and son of perdition, and the church would be gathered in martyrdom unto Christ. John portrays this by the dragon and beast being loosed from the bottomless pit and the mortal wound to the beast’s head having healed. John described the beast in Rev. 17:8 as the beast that “was and is not and is about to ascend out of the bottomless pit.” That is, the persecuting power of the empire that suffered defeat by the collapse of the persecution over St. Stephen was about to manifest itself again, this time under Nero, whose name the beast bore. This is the point at which the battle of Gog and Magog begins:

the adversary in this case was world civil power embodied in Rome, Nero, and the Jews. In Rome, the beast was identified with Nero, who was its driving power (Rev. 13:1-10); in Asia and other parts of the empire, the Jews, at the behest of their leaders in Jerusalem, were the driving force. John portrays this by a harlot, riding the beast in a surfeit of blood and gore. (Rev. 17:3-6) In Palestine, the persecution was driven by the “false prophet,” the religious leaders of the Jews who bade them to make an inquisition against the church like unto the beast’s. (Rev. 13:11-18) The dragon and beast make war against the church by surrounding the “camp of the saints” (the church). But fire comes down from God out of heaven and consumes Gog and his host, and the dragon, beast, and false prophet are cast into the lake of fire. (Rev. 19:20, 21; 20:9, 10) The harlot is also consumed. (Rev. 18) An angel calls to the birds of heaven to come and devour the carcasses of the slain. (Rev. 19:17, 18; cf. Ezek. 39:17) Following the world-wide devastations of the last days, God renews the earth, in which the church reigns supreme with Christ. (Rev. 21, 22)

The name Nero is proverbial for murder, rape, sodomy, incest, cruelty, and every kind of crime imaginable.

The emperor Nero was blamed by the Roman populace for the great fire that broke out in Rome in 64 A.D., and in turn blamed the Christians. The Roman historian Tacitus explains what happened in his narrative.

The execution of Christian was a comic relief to Nero and

the c l i m a x of these cruel shows was the mockery of the crucifixion of Christ: according to a second-century tradition, the Christian leader Peter was crucified upside down.

Was this the man of sin revealed?

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Is this Gog and Magog and the man of sin?
Posted : 20 Dec, 2019 04:36 PM

Zec 14:12 And the LORD will send a plague on all the nations that fought against Jerusalem. Their people will become like walking corpses, their flesh rotting away. Their eyes will rot in their sockets, and their tongues will rot in their mouths.

Could this be the plague?

Also there was the eruption of Vesuvius in 79 A.D. ! Alot going on between the 1st and 3rd centuries!

I have written in my bible : Cerca trova, Italian for seek and you shall find...

From a medical article from US National Library of Medicine:

[The Antonine Plague and the decline of the Roman Empire].

[Article in Italian]

Sabbatani S1, Fiorino S.

Author information

1

Unita Operativa di Malattie Infettive, Ospedale Civile di Budrio, Bologna, Italy.

Abstract

The Antonine Plague, which flared up during the reign of Marcus Aurelius from 165 AD and continued under the rule of his son Commodus, played such a major role that the pathocenosis in the Ancient World was changed. The spread of the epidemic was favoured by the occurrence of two military episodes in which Marcus Aurelius himself took part: the Parthian War in Mesopotamia and the wars against the Marcomanni in northeastern Italy, in Noricum and in Pannonia. Accounts of the clinical features of the epidemic are scant and disjointed, with the main source being Galen, who witnessed the plague. Unfortunately, the great physician provides us with only a brief presentation of the disease, his aim being to supply therapeutic approaches, thus passing over the accurate description of the disease symptoms. Although the reports of some clinical cases treated by Galen lead us to think that the Antonine plague was caused by smallpox, palaeopathological confirmation is lacking. Some archaeological evidence (such as terracotta finds) from Italy might reinforce this opinion. In these finds, some details can be observed, suggesting the artist's purpose to represent the classic smallpox pustules, typical signs of the disease. The extent of the epidemic has been extensively debated: the majority of authors agree that the impact of the plague was severe, influencing military conscription, the agricultural and urban economy, and depleting the coffers of the State. The Antonine plague affected ancient Roman traditions, also leaving a mark on artistic expression; a renewal of spirituality and religiousness was recorded. These events created the conditions for the spread of monotheistic religions, such as Mithraism and Christianity. This period, characterized by health, social and economic crises, paved the way for the entry into the Empire of neighbouring barbarian tribes and the recruitment of barbarian troops into the Roman army; these events particularly favoured the cultural and political growth of these populations. The Antonine Plague may well have created the conditions for the decline of the Roman Empire and, afterwards, for its fall in the West in the fifth century AD.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2004611

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KJVonly

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Is this Gog and Magog and the man of sin?
Posted : 20 Dec, 2019 05:00 PM

Here is Zecharyah 14:12 in context

https://www.blueletterbible.org/nlt/zec/14/12/s_925012



Also found Hosea 13 (Relentless judgement on Israel ) and Joel 2 (day of Lord)

13th chapter. Wonder if that is why 13 is a superstitious number, LOL!

NO, I am not superstitious! Just saying.

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Is this Gog and Magog and the man of sin?
Posted : 20 Dec, 2019 05:10 PM

Hey Parrot..

Not saying we won't have persecution from the RCC again. They had incredibly vile torture tactics in the dark ages.

Iron maidens, stretching racks, placed in stocks, boiled alive like lobsters sawings crucifixions, impalements ,hangings, etc..

BUT in the context of the first century maybe you will see that Nero may have been THE man of sin revealed in the 1st century.

Antichrists are rampant . History has proven that over and over. There are more than one.

1 John 2:22 - Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

Timothy 3

16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

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Is this Gog and Magog and the man of sin?
Posted : 20 Dec, 2019 05:44 PM

The following Scripture from God's Word can not be found in the Preterist or KJVonly Bibles!!



**WILL THE CHURCH SAINTS AND THE LOST BE RESURRECTED ON THE SAME **LAST DAY** WHICH IS ALSO THE **DAY OF THE LORD** IS THE WORD RAPTURE IN GOD'S WORD**??



**WHAT DOES GOD'S WORD SAY**??



John 12:48: Jesus says, "There is a Judge for the one who rejects Me and does not accept My words, that very word which I spoke will condemn him on the **LAST DAY**!" {See Matthew 25:31-46; Daniel 12:1,2 and John 5:28}



John 6:40: Jesus says, ""For My Father's will is that **EVERYONE** who looks to the Son and believes in Him {**CHURCH SAINTS**} shall have eternal life, and I will raise him up at the {**SAME**} **LAST DAY**!"



**WILL THE **7TH AND LAST TRUMP** SOUND ON THE **DAY OF THE LORD** WHICH IS ALSO THE **LAST DAY**??



**THE FOLLOWING SCRIPTURES ARE RELATED TO THE **7TH AND LAST TRUMP** MENTIONED IN I CORINTHIANS 15:51**!



The only 2 resurrections mentioned in Revelation are **POST-TRIB** and are found in Revelation 14:14-16 and Revelation 11:15-18 when the **7TH AND LAST ANGEL** will sound the **7TH AND LAST TRUMP**!!



Revelation 8:2: I saw the 7 angels who **STAND BEFORE GOD** and **7 TRUMPETS** were given to them.



**NOTE**: The first 6 trumpets will be sounded **DURING** and not **BEFORE** the Great Tribulation in Revelation 8:7 to Revelation 9:21!!!



And then on the Last Day of the Great Tribulation just before the 2nd Coming of Jesus for **HIS CHURCH SAINTS** we read in:



Revelation 11:15,18: The 7th {*AND LAST} angel sounded his {**LAST**} **TRUMPET**, and there were loud voices in heaven which said: "The Kingdom of the world has become the Kingdom of our Lord and of His Messiah, and He will reign for ever and ever... The time has come for judging the dead, and for rewarding your servants the prophets and your saints and those who reverence your name (**CHURCH SAINTS**}, both small and great and for destroying those who destroy the earth!"



I Corinthians 15:50-52: I declare to you, brothers, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God. Listen, I tell you a **MYSTERY** {See Rev 10:7 above}, we will not all sleep, but we **ALL** will be changed--in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, **AT THE LAST TRUMPET**. For the {7th & Last} **TRUMPET** will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and **WE** {**CHURCH SAINTS**} will be changed!!



Now the pre-tribbers make the ridiculous claim that this {**7TH**AND} **LAST TRUMP** in I Corinthians 15:51; when all the **CHURCH SAINTS** receive their new heavenly bodies; will take place at a pre-trib rapture just **BEFORE** the Great Tribulation and the coming of 666 even though the first 6 trumpets take place **DURING** the Great Tribulation???



**IS THE PRE-TRIB TRANSLATION OF THE GREEK WORD **HARPAZO** IN REVELATION 4:17 AS **RAPTURE** AN **EVIL SIN**??



According to Webster's dictionary the **RAPTURE** means "An expression or manifestation of **ECSTASY** or **PASSION**" The pre-tribbers claim that the Greek word **HARPAZO** in I Thessalonians 4:17 can be translated **RAPTURE** while the NIV, RSV and KJV versions translate **HARPAZO** to be **CAUGHT UP** and the Todays English version translates it to be **GATHERED UP**!



However, the word **ECSTASY** is never mention in God's Word and means a "State of being beyond reason and self control, swoon or trance"! The words **PASSION**, passions and passionate are mentioned 7 times in God's Word and **EACH TIME** it is an **EVIL SIN** as per Romans 7:5, Galatians 5:24, I Corinthians 7:9, I Thessalonians 4:5, Titus 2:12, Titus 3:3 and Hosea 7:6.



I Thessalonians 4:16,17: For the Lord Himself will come down from heaven, with a **LOUD COMMAND**, with the voice of the Archangel and with the {7TH & LAST}**TRUMPET CALL OF GOD**, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that we who are still alive and are left will be **CAUGHT UP** {*RAPTURED*??} together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air!



And so the pre-trib translation of the Greek word Harpazo as **RAPTURE** which means "An expression or manifestation of **ECSTASY** or **PASSION**", is an **EVIL SIN**!! And when all of God's saints are **CAUGHT UP** to heaven and receive their eternal heavenly bodies they will no longer sin and will have **EVERLASTING RIGHTEOUSNESS** on the **LAST DAY** of the 70 7's which is also the **LAST DAY** of the 42-month Great Tribulation!!



Daniel 9:24: 70 7's {Or 490 years} are decreed {From the decree of Cyrus} to Anoint the Most Holy {After 69 7's or 483 years}, To Atone for Wickedness {After 69 1/2 7's or 486 1/2 years} to finish transgession, put and end to sin and to bring in **EVERLASTING RIGHTEOUSNESS** on the **LAST DAY** of the 70 7's or 490 years which is also the **LAST DAY** of the 42- month Great Tribulation!



Titus 2:13: **WE**{**CHURCH SAINTS**} wait for the **BLESSED HOPE**--the **GLORIOUS APPEARING** of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ!!

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Is this Gog and Magog and the man of sin?
Posted : 20 Dec, 2019 10:07 PM

These groups made up the Church when they were all grafted in together . We are all one in Christ Jesus.

When anyone is converted today , they are added to the kingdom. When they die, the same Spirit that resurrected Christ also resurrects them to be with Him in Heaven.

These people made up the Church then and anyone now who is converted is added to the kingdom.

At least that is my understanding .

1) The Jews: The observant Jews who reject the Greek culture and language.

2) The Hellenists: The Jews who adopted the Greek culture and language.

3) The Nations: The Jews from the ten lost tribes.

4) The Strangers: Non-Jews who join themselves with the Jews.

When Israel came out of Egypt, it was not just Israelites who came out, but a multitude of others. And the LORD gave the people favour in the sight of the Egyptians, so that they lent unto them such things as they required. And they spoiled the Egyptians. And the children of Israel journeyed from Rameses to Succoth, about six hundred thousand on foot that were men, beside children. And a mixed multitude went up also with them; and flocks, and herds, even very much cattle. (Exodus 12:36-38, KJV)

The Israelites journeyed from Rameses to Succoth. There were about six hundred thousand men on foot, besides women and children. Many other people went up with them. (Exodus 12:37,38)

These foreigners were to be treated the same as the Israelites.

The alien living with you must be treated as one of your native-born. Love him as yourself, for you were aliens in Egypt. I am the LORD your God. (Leviticus 19:34)

"You are to have the same laws (mishpat) for the alien and the native-born. I am the LORD your God." (Leviticus 24:22)

Even Paul in the New Testament understood this and recognized that anyone could join Israel, just as they did in ancient times.

That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world. (Ephesians 2:12, KJV)

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Is this Gog and Magog and the man of sin?
Posted : 21 Dec, 2019 12:27 AM

Buying and selling...

Roman citizens were required to publicly claim allegiance to Caesar by burning incense in his honor and proclaiming that “Caesar is Lord”. Those who did this received a document that allowed them to buy and sell in the marketplace. Without it, no one could purchase anything. Therefore, the “Mark of the Beast” – or the document that showed your allegiance to Nero as Lord – was required to buy and sell if you lived during the time when John wrote his epistle to the seven churches.

You’ve probably heard that the “seven mountains” correspond to the seven hills of Rome. However, did you know that the seven kings also point to Nero as “The Beast”? They do. Because John tells us that: “Five have fallen, one is, the other has not yet come and when he comes, he must remain a little while.”

According to Josephus, the Roman historian, Julius Caesar was the first king, followed by August, Tiberius, Caligula and Claudius. The sixth king? That was Nero. So, he is the “one (who) is”.

The seventh king – the one who followed Nero – was Galba, and as John prophesied, he reigned for a short time (about seven months).

Servius Sulpicius Galba was Roman emperor from 68 to 69. In rebellion against Nero, rejected the title "General of Caesar" in favor of "General of the Senate and People of Rome".

Died‎: ‎15 January 69 (aged 70); Rome Successor‎: ‎Otho who reigned for 3 months.

Galba Reign‎: ‎8 June 68 – 15 January 69; (7 months) Born‎: ‎24 December 3 BC; Near Terracina, Italy

Nero, as the sixth king of Rome, was the first to persecute Christians in the First Century. He started persecuting them in November of 64 AD and ended on June 8, 68 AD when he killed himself. That was 42 months of persecution. Notice what John says about “The Beast”:

“And there was given to him a mouth speaking arrogant words and blasphemies; and authority to act for forty-two months was given him.” (Rev. 13:5)

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Is this Gog and Magog and the man of sin?
Posted : 21 Dec, 2019 12:39 AM

Interesting verses about rotting people that seem to correspond to Zech 14:12

Zechariah 14:12

Now this will be the plague with which the LORD will strike all the peoples who have gone to war against Jerusalem; their flesh will rot while they stand on their feet, and their eyes will rot in their sockets, and their tongue will rot in their mouth.

Leviticus 26:39

'So those of you who may be left will rot away because of their iniquity in the lands of your enemies; and also because of the iniquities of their forefathers they will rot away with them.

Job 13:28

While I am decaying like a rotten thing, Like a garment that is moth-eaten.

Isaiah 5:24

Therefore, as a tongue of fire consumes stubble And dry grass collapses into the flame, So their root will become like rot and their blossom blow away as dust; For they have rejected the law of the LORD of hosts And despised the word of the Holy One of Israel.

2 Corinthians 4:16

Therefore we do not lose heart, but though our outer man is decaying, yet our inner man is being renewed day by day.

Proverbs 10:7

The memory of the righteous is blessed, But the name of the wicked will rot.

Proverbs 14:30

A tranquil heart is life to the body, But passion is rottenness to the bones.

Proverbs 12:4

An excellent wife is the crown of her husband, But she who shames him is like rottenness in his bones.

Habakkuk 3:16

I heard and my inward parts trembled, At the sound my lips quivered Decay enters my bones, And in my place I tremble Because I must wait quietly for the day of distress, For the people to arise who will invade us.

Isaiah 3:24

Now it will come about that instead of sweet perfume there will be putrefaction; Instead of a belt, a rope; Instead of well-set hair, a plucked-out scalp; Instead of fine clothes, a donning of sackcloth; And branding instead of beauty.

Hosea 5:12

Therefore I am like a moth to Ephraim And like rottenness to the house of Judah.

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Is this Gog and Magog and the man of sin?
Posted : 21 Dec, 2019 07:19 PM

This is not Bible discussions.... as KJV says "When I copied and pasted out of my email , it got pasted twice. SORRY!" We all know prophetic does copy and paste. So now you admit you do -- these threads are ruined by people who don't have a thought in their head except to see who can copy and paste the most. God is NOT pleased with this.

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Is this Gog and Magog and the man of sin?
Posted : 22 Dec, 2019 05:39 AM

As usual needsafriend7 has nothing to contribute to any Bible discussion. She is a member of the Church of Christ which teaches the ridiculous Satanic belief that you are saved by water baptism.



Hebrews 9:22; 26-28: The law requires that nearly everything be cleansed with blood, and without the shedding of blood **THERE IS NO FORGIVENESS**.... But now He has appeared **ONCE FOR ALL** at the end of the ages to do away with sin **BY THE SACRIFICE OF HIMSELF**!! Just as man is destined to die once, and after that to face judgment, and Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many people, and He will appear a second time {And not a third time}, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for Him!!

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Is this Gog and Magog and the man of sin?
Posted : 22 Dec, 2019 07:51 PM

OMG - prophetic actually read what I wrote instead of just copy and paste. he said "As usual needsafriend7 has nothing to contribute to any Bible discussion. She is a member of the Church of Christ which teaches the ridiculous Satanic belief that you are saved by water baptism." this is a statement against almost every Christian religions. You have no beliefs, just the ability to copy and paste. I try every day to do the right things to get to Heaven -- copy, paste, and degrading people is not the way to go.

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