I am still on the fence with John McArthur.... He had that quote I can't get out of my head...The blood doesn't save. You are saved by his death (sacrifice) ...then he says , The blood is just a euphemistic way of saying death...Well euphemistic means the same thing, just said in a different way....so does the blood save or death? I know his sacrifice takes away sins and his blood saves us from wrath. I wonder how you defend McArthur on this since to me he seems to be speaking in riddles since he said there wasn't anything magic in his blood. .
Trust in Jesus is all about Faith in Him and what he done on the Cross.
He die for all the sins if Mankind, past , present, and future. Our focus, as s Believer should be in Jesus Christ alone. He was fully man and fully God.
God's on son. We don't have to figure it out. God is a miracle worker and Almighty.
**SAD**lup believes that we are saved because of righteous things we have done and our repentance from sin and obeying OT laws???
**BUT WHAT DOES GOD'S WORD SAY**??
Titus 3:3,4: At one time we too were foolish, disobedient, deceived and enslaved by all kinds of passions and pleasures. We lived in malice and envy, being hated and hating one another. But when the kindness and **LOVE** of God our Savior appeared , **HE SAVED US**, **NOT BECAUSE OF RIGHTEOUS THINGS WE HAD DONE**, but because of **HIS MERCY**!!
**FAITH** IS 100% FREE GIFT OF GOD**!!
Ephesians 2:8,9: For it is by **GRACE** you have been saved, through ***FAITH***—and this **NOT FROM YOURSELVES**, it is the **GIFT OF GOD**—not by works. So that no one can boast. For we are **GOD'S WORKMANSHIP**, created in Christ Jesus to do **GOOD WORKS**, which God prepared in advance for us to do!
Romans 3:21-25: But now a righteousness from God, **APART FROM THE LAW**, has been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets testify. This righteousness from God comes **THROUGH FAITH** in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference, for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified freely by **HIS GRACE** through the **REDEMPTION** that came by Christ Jesus. God presented Him as a **SACRIFICE OF ATONEMENT**, **THROUGH FAITH IN HIS BLOOD**!! ( And our **FAITH** is a **FREE GIFT FROM GOD**!!}
Romans 12:3: For by the **GRACE GIVEN ME** I say to every one of you. Do not think of yourself more highly than you ought, but rather think of yourselves with sober judgment, in accordance with the ***FAITH*** GOD HAS DISTRIBUTED TO EACH OF YOU**... We have different gifts, according to the **GRACE GIVEN TO EACH OF US**!!
John 6:37,39,44,65: Jesus says, "**ALL** that the Father gives Me **WILL** come to Me, and whoever comes to Me I will **NEVER** drive away... And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that I shall **LOSE NONE** of all that He has given Me, but raise them up at the Last Day.... No one can come to Me **UNLESS** the Father who sent Me **DRAWS HIM**, and I will raise him up at the Last Day!!... No one can come to Me **UNLESS** the Father has **ENABLED THEM**!!"
I Peter 2:9: But you are a **CHOSEN PEOPLE**, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, God's special possession, that you might declare the praise of Him who **CALLED YOU** out of darkness into His wonderful light!!
Revelation 17:14: They will make war against the **LAMB** but the **LAMB** will overcome them because He is **LORD** of lords and **KING** of kings and with Him will be His **CALLED** **CHOSEN** and **FAITHFUL** followers!! {Riding on white horses right after the Marriage Feast of the **LAMB** as per Revelation 19:7-20!}
All of God's **CALLED ** **CHOSEN** AND **FAITHFUL** saints are eager to do **GOOD WORKS** with the hope of countless **ETERNAL HEAVEBLY REWARDS** for faithful and loving service!!
Matthew 16:27: Jesus says, " For the Son of Man is going to come in His Father's glory with His angels, and **THEN** He will **REWARD** everyone **ACCORDING TO WHAT THEY HAVE DONE**!"
Revelation 22:12: Jesus says, "Behold. I am coming soon. My **REWARD** is **WITH ME**, and I will give to everyone **ACCORDING TO WHAT THEY HAVE DONE**!!"
Hey there! See if I can trigger you some thoughts. You have boxed yourself into thinking of only the literial blood and its death. Is it not just symbolic of what the real sacrifice is?
Quote
"Since Jesus did not have a biological earthly father , does that make part of his DNA celestial from the Heavenly Father? He had his mother's DNA"
Did Adam have a biological earthly father or mother? Where did Adam come from? The Bible says he was made from the dirt of the earth and that's what I'm made of, what about you? Where did you come? The rib of Adam originally?
So DNA is just another detail or quality of a human or animal, just as blood is. Key thought NOW we should be thinking..... It all comes from Yahweh! Correct?
Sadlup is right on point when he says that we should really break away from the cult teachings of the majority of the churches that say, trust in us, because we have "teachings about J_sus" you need to know. But Yah'shua says to trust in Him, His teachings or "in the teachings OF J_sus" (Yah'shua)
"He die for all the sins if Mankind, past , present, and future. Our focus, as s Believer should be in Jesus Christ alone. He was fully man and fully God.
God's on son. We don't have to figure it out.
Yes He did die for ALL the sins of mankind and then you state "We don't have to figure it out" in what the Bible says of REPENTANCE in order to be saved BY FAITH?
Really? You state an incomplete gospel message of the plan (package) of salvation!
Man do you have some issues, for lack of better descriptive words!
Quote:
"Sadlup believes that we are saved because of righteous things we have done and our repentance from sin and obeying OT laws???"
Really??? I cannot find even once in the context of all his comments throughout this forum where he has said what you claim.
NOW, I have seen you post MILES of self interpreted in BOLD dribble of Scripture and attempted (distorted) postings of what Sadlup said before and I proved you wrong.
So enlighten me! Give me evidence, an exact Quote of what Sadlup says on the subject matter here above. I have CAUGHT you red handed adding words to his posts and you have been busted!
So lets see if your lying or not, prove where he said the above in quote of what you accuse him of.
I think I get what you and sadlup are saying and that is we should not focus on his blood because it is our faith in him that saves? Yes, I can see where you think maybe I am worshiping the blood ..It made such an impact on my life and washed me clean that I get stuck on that too much . I agree! And yes Sadlup, the saving knowledge brought me to repentance when I was convicted of sin. Does that make sense?. I was so tired last night. I was up til after 2 am. .I should have been more thorough , sorry. Yes, we need the faith of Jesus.
I sidestepped your question because I knew you would refuse the answer. I've reconsidered because you deserve to hear truth regardless of me thinking you'll reject it. Here's your question & answer vvv
*Since Jesus did not have a biological earthly father
> That is debatable. Paul seems to know nothing about it. The Hebrew Gospel of Matthew doesn't contain it. And it is only mentioned twice in the entire Greek New Testament (Matt & Luke). Personally it makes no difference to me either way. Why will become clear later in this post<
*does that make part of his DNA celestial from the Heavenly Father?
> Okay let's be REAL here: If in fact Jesus had celestial DNA from the Father, by definition this would make Jesus a "Demigod". For example Apollo is considered a demigod because he is a son of Zeus.
But let's back up here. In all honesty the Bible doesn't indicate "How" Mary concieved, other than she was overshadowed by the Holy Spirit (like in Genesis the Spirit hovering over the waters). Therefore NOTHING as to DNA can be determined. It's all conjecture.<
*He had his mother's DNA and he was born under the curse of the law .
>Again who's to say what DNA Jesus had? It's ALL conjecture. With only knowing the Holy Spirit overshadowed Mary gives us the following possibilities:
1) No human DNA - (all from God)
2) All Mary's DNA - (other half modified by the Spirit but still from her)
3) Half Mary's DNA, Half God's DNA
4) Mary and Joseph's DNA supernaturally infused with God's Spirit
5) Mary and Joseph's DNA supernaturally infused with a Spirit sent from God.<
*She had to be purified and bring sacrifices.
> Only because it was required by Torah because of the issue of blood, but her blood - (mother and child do not share the same blood) <
*Jesus is fully God and fully man. God in the flesh..so is his blood spotless ?
> There are numerous ways to be considered fully God and fully man without being a DNA demigod. Basically what you are asking is; Does the actual DNA Blood of Jesus have supernatural properties? You have the chicken and the egg scenario; Was Jesus righteous because he had supernatural blood or was Jesus' blood supernatural because he was righteous?<
*Is he a proper sacrifice?
> Depends how you define "proper" As a ceremonial sacrifice? No; Jesus was killed outside the Temple and human sacrifice is forbidden. However Jesus did sacrifice his life in obedience to the Father for us. And if we believe and embrace his sacrifice we are promised to be infused with a Spirit like his sent from God.<
*Would you say that since animals could not take away sin, then how is it he can?
>When you believe God loves you so much that He would hold nothing good back from you. And even send His very own Son knowing he would be tortured and murdered - essentially sacrificing him on your behalf; this leads those with the right hearts into repentance. And then infuses them with the Holy Spirit to do right.
When people realize it is not about "paid debt" or "sacrifice for sin" but a demonstration of the Love of God for us despite our sins - that my friends when we embrace God on a whole new level and have a God given desire to repent from sin.<
**SAD**lup believes that Jesus is **NOT GOD** and His **BLOOD SACRIFICE** does not forgive sin and the **FAITH** is not a **FREE GIFT OF GOD** and that we are only saved because of righteous things we have done and our repentance from sin and obeying OT laws???
**BUT WHAT DOES GOD'S WORD SAY**??
Titus 3:3,4: At one time we too were foolish, disobedient, deceived and enslaved by all kinds of passions and pleasures. We lived in malice and envy, being hated and hating one another. But when the kindness and **LOVE** of God our Savior appeared , **HE SAVED US**, **NOT BECAUSE OF RIGHTEOUS THINGS WE HAD DONE**, but because of **HIS MERCY**!!
**FAITH** IS 100% FREE GIFT OF GOD**!!
Ephesians 2:8,9: For it is by **GRACE** you have been saved, through ***FAITH***—and this **NOT FROM YOURSELVES**, it is the **GIFT OF GOD**—not by works. So that no one can boast. For we are **GOD'S WORKMANSHIP**, created in Christ Jesus to do **GOOD WORKS**, which God prepared in advance for us to do!
Romans 3:21-25: But now a righteousness from God, **APART FROM THE LAW**, has been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets testify. This righteousness from God comes **THROUGH FAITH** in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference, for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified freely by **HIS GRACE** through the **REDEMPTION** that came by Christ Jesus. God presented Him as a **SACRIFICE OF ATONEMENT**, **THROUGH FAITH IN HIS BLOOD**!! ( And our **FAITH** is a **FREE GIFT FROM GOD**!!}
Romans 12:3: For by the **GRACE GIVEN ME** I say to every one of you. Do not think of yourself more highly than you ought, but rather think of yourselves with sober judgment, in accordance with the ***FAITH*** GOD HAS DISTRIBUTED TO EACH OF YOU**... We have different gifts, according to the **GRACE GIVEN TO EACH OF US**!!
John 6:37,39,44,65: Jesus says, "**ALL** that the Father gives Me **WILL** come to Me, and whoever comes to Me I will **NEVER** drive away... And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that I shall **LOSE NONE** of all that He has given Me, but raise them up at the Last Day.... No one can come to Me **UNLESS** the Father who sent Me **DRAWS HIM**, and I will raise him up at the Last Day!!... No one can come to Me **UNLESS** the Father has **ENABLED THEM**!!"
I Peter 2:9: But you are a **CHOSEN PEOPLE**, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, God's special possession, that you might declare the praise of Him who **CALLED YOU** out of darkness into His wonderful light!!
Revelation 17:14: They will make war against the **LAMB** but the **LAMB** will overcome them because He is **LORD** of lords and **KING** of kings and with Him will be His **CALLED** **CHOSEN** and **FAITHFUL** followers!! {Riding on white horses right after the Marriage Feast of the **LAMB** as per Revelation 19:7-20!}
All of God's **CALLED ** **CHOSEN** AND **FAITHFUL** saints are eager to do **GOOD WORKS** with the hope of countless **ETERNAL HEAVENLY REWARDS** for faithful and loving service!!
Matthew 16:27: Jesus says, " For the Son of Man is going to come in His Father's glory with His angels, and **THEN** He will **REWARD** everyone **ACCORDING TO WHAT THEY HAVE DONE**!"
Revelation 22:12: Jesus says, "Behold. I am coming soon. My **REWARD** is **WITH ME**, and I will give to everyone **ACCORDING TO WHAT THEY HAVE DONE**!!"
Thank you sadlup for posting an answer. Your time is valuable and appreciated. I am glad you decided to engage further in this discussion.
If I had to choose another option, it would be this one:
2) All Mary's DNA - (other half modified by the Spirit but still from her)
You make a good point that we don't know exactly what the Holy Spirit did during conception. My conclusion was he did not have a human fathers DNA because he was without sin and therefore not required to bring a sin offering. He was not connected to Adam's bloodline in any way. Does that make sense why I mentioned DNA in the first place?
I would definitely discount modified DNA from Joseph since Mary was a virgin and knew no man ...yet! The catholics think she is a perpetual virgin.....but that is another topic for another day...
Yes, at the end of your post, you can sum it up in this verse..I remember it well, my lady neighbor has it tattooed on her arm. (Romans 5:8)
Romans 5:8 King James Version (KJV)
8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
