A young man emailed me on this site and questioned my calling to be a youth pastor because he said that women should not be allowed to be pastors. He quoted 1 Corinthians 11 and 1 Timothy 2 as his reasons. What are your thoughts out there? I'll post my response later, but I was just curious to hear what BIBLICAL references those of you might have towards this topic!
genesis 1:26-27 26 Then God said, "Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth." 27 So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.
then we see here that JESUS tells them if they seen HIM theyve seen the FATHER.
john 14:7-9 7 "If you had known Me, you would have known My Father also; and from now on you know Him and have seen Him."
Christ Answers Philip
8 Philip said to Him, "Lord, show us the Father, and it is sufficient for us."
9 Jesus said to him, "Have I been with you so long, and yet you have not known Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, Show us the Father?
as we know, JESUS did not come as a woman.. GOD made man in HIS image.. and anyone who seen JESUS as by HIS own words says theyve seen the FATHER. this is not to put any woman down.. just what the word says..
It is clear that Jesus intended his apostles and priests to be males, yes, but apostles and priests perform but one but many important roles in the Church. Also, I hope you're not suggesting we define God to a specific gender. He can not be defined by mere human words.
It's important to apply faith and reason to the Bible, and look to the tradition of early Christians for their real meaning. Otherwise they lose meaning. Applying human constructs to the awesomeness of God sounds unreasonable, no?
If you read "in our image" in context, it speaks to how God has made man different from animals, not a carbon copy of himself. A clearer reading would suggest the "image" is our rational senses and/or yearning for love. More to the point though: We do not have God's body for God is spirit* and has no body (Jn 4:24, Lk 24:39). (Also see statement #370 in the Catechism)
*Again, don't mean to limit the awesomeness of God by using human terms.
genesis 2:18-24 18 And the Lord God said, "It is not good that man should be alone; I will make him a helper comparable to him." 19 Out of the ground the Lord God formed every beast of the field and every bird of the air, and brought them to Adam to see what he would call them. And whatever Adam called each living creature, that was its name. 20 So Adam gave names to all cattle, to the birds of the air, and to every beast of the field. But for Adam there was not found a helper comparable to him.
21 And the Lord God caused a deep sleep to fall on Adam, and he slept; and He took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh in its place. 22 Then the rib which the Lord God had taken from man He made into a woman, and He brought her to the man.
23 And Adam said:
"This is now bone of my bones
And flesh of my flesh;
She shall be called Woman,
Because she was taken out of Man."
24 Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and they shall become one flesh.
now folks as we see here in genesis that man was formed first.. and that GOD said that it was not good for man to live alone.. so then after adam had named all the creatures and found none that were found to be a helper comparable to him.. so then the GOD made adam fall into a deep sleep and took a rib from him and made woman.
now what we see here is that man was made in GODS image.. and that just means that we bear a reassemblance to GOD. and if GOD had just wanted a companion for adam HE could of just made another man.. but yet GOD had the most wonderful plan for man.. HE made woman to complete the man..she would be his helper. the man will be with his wife and the two will become one flesh..
now i praise GOD and thank GOD for women..
but if youll notice that GOD always has an order to things.. HE gave you the order in the christian home and an order for the church.. men and women both are the same in CHRIST .. i dont think any less of a woman,, just that shes different .but yet they both were given different roles..
now as to cd your question again..
when JESUS rose again and met with HIS diciples .. HE came to them in HIS own body. as we can see in the scriptures below.. HE let them feel his wounds.. they were affraid HE was a spirit.. and then we can see that as HE accended they dont say that HE changed form.. as to that we really dont know.. what happened when HE got out of sight into the heavens... except that HE is now at the right hand throne of GOD ,to intercede for us .
luke 24:36-52 36 Now as they said these things, Jesus Himself stood in the midst of them, and said to them, "Peace to you." 37 But they were terrified and frightened, and supposed they had seen a spirit. 38 And He said to them, "Why are you troubled? And why do doubts arise in your hearts? 39 Behold My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself. Handle Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see I have."
40 When He had said this, He showed them His hands and His feet. 41 But while they still did not believe for joy, and marveled, He said to them, "Have you any food here?" 42 So they gave Him a piece of a broiled fish and some honeycomb. 43 And He took it and ate in their presence.
The Great Commission
Acts 1:3-8
44 Then He said to them, "These are the words which I spoke to you while I was still with you, that all things must be fulfilled which were written in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms concerning Me." 45 And He opened their understanding, that they might comprehend the Scriptures.
46 Then He said to them, "Thus it is written, and thus it was necessary for the Christ to suffer and to rise from the dead the third day, 47 and that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in His name to all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. 48 And you are witnesses of these things.
The Ascension
Mark 16:19; Acts 1:9
49 Behold, I send the Promise of My Father upon you; but tarry in the city of Jerusalem until you are endued with power from on high."
50 And He led them out as far as Bethany, and He lifted up His hands and blessed them. 51 Now it came to pass, while He blessed them, that He was parted from them and carried up into heaven. 52 And they worshiped Him, and returned to Jerusalem with great joy, 53 and were continually in the temple praising and blessing God. Amen.
1 corinthians 15:49 And as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly Man.
How can you apply "in our image" to the second creation story and neglect that the full quote is "in the divine image he created him; male and female he created them"? Male and female were created in the divine image equally and bound to each other. The second account does not exalt man (yes, there is order to male-female relationships, and their roles are equal in value and come together to form one), but rather shows how female shares in the divine image bestowed upon man.
It's also important to note that biblical scribes were trapped by the limitations of human terms. In Hebrew nor in Aramaic, an object has no gender-neutral form. Thus, the scribes were limited to terms that have been later been translated and interpreted as specifically single gendered.
Male/female are human constructions, formed out of limitations, but likely to describe qualities. Jesus makes it quite clear that God is spirit (Jn 4:24) and that spirit has no body (Lk 24:39). In Mt 22:23-30, its says marriage and sexual relationships - the basis of male/female roles, no? - are not present in heaven.
In closing: Jesus also made it clear that God is our Father. We should address Him as such, yes, but we should not limit Him to the earthly definitions.
Nor attempt to exalt males above their equals. Indeed, we have some great examples in the church. There is Mary, the Mother and a Queen in the ancient Hebrew culture, is a powerful intercessor. And the three Marys were called to give the good news of Christ's resurrection to the all-male apostles, the predecessors of the priests.
gwnwsis 27 So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.
lets look closely at this verse.. the verse says that GOD created man in HIS own image... in the image of GOD HE created him.. now as you can see GOD created man in HIS own image..
then it says male and female HE created them... so to me thats just telling us exactly what is says, that GOD created man and woman.. because it doesnt say created them in HIS image.
man was made first in HIS image.. and then later woman was made from man.. a helper or helpmeet made comparable to man... because it was not good for man to be alone..
then we see that JESUS came to us as a man...
then
1 corinthians 11:7-10 7 For a man indeed ought not to cover his head, since he is the image and glory of God; but woman is the glory of man. 8 For man is not from woman, but woman from man. 9 Nor was man created for the woman, but woman for the man. 10 For this reason the woman ought to have a symbol of authority on her head, because of the angels.
dear teach, i just noticed where you state that you are a youth pastor.. i find that to be slightly different than being the pastor of the church and may not be anything wrong with that.. .. and ill tell ya why possibly that may be... when we see the verses that say the women are to remain silent in the church.. i feel that means in the inner sanctuary with the main congregation.
1 timothy 2:11-12 11 Let a woman learn in silence with all submission. 12 And I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man, but to be in silence.
now as we can see here.. the verse tells us that the woman is not to teach or have authority over a man..
yet what youre speakin of is you are teaching the youth.. not the men.. and since you are not in the sanctuary..teaching the men. that may well be permissable..
and also i would think it would be ok for a woman to lead and teach the womens ministry.. and ill tell ya why.. same reason youre not in the sanctuary.. not teaching the whole congregation.. men included... as we can see here in titus that the older women are to be teachers of good things and to teach the younger women..
qualities of a sound church
titus 2:3-5 3 the older women likewise, that they be reverent in behavior, not slanderers, not given to much wine, teachers of good things- 4 that they admonish the young women to love their husbands, to love their children, 5 to be discreet, chaste, homemakers, good, obedient to their own husbands, that the word of God may not be blasphemed.
see i believe women do have ministries.. just not the pastor of the church.. nor to teach the whole congregation. men included...
The answer is not to look at the verse closely in isolation, but broadly and within context of the scribes' style, other passages, and tradition.
When you do, you discover that the image can not be a physical image because God has no body (Jn 4:24, Lk 24:39) to grant Adam. If he did, why does the gospel of John make mention that the "Word became flesh" (Jn 1:14)? Without a body nor in marriage (Mt 22:30), there are no gender roles familiar to the one's we know. It's reasonable to believe that we address God as He, Him, Father due solely to the relation to Jesus, who called him Father.
The image is what separates man (as in humankind) from animal, and in this image woman shares as a necessary, fulfilling partner.
