Is "spiritual" discernment an objective judgment of the mind, or a subjective intuition of the spirit?
By: Gregory Koukl
I had a challenge from a friend a couple days ago that I've heard many times. Maybe it's been leveled at you, too. It has to do with spiritual discernment. Am I in my "head" too much when I do spiritual discernment, and not enough "in the Spirit"? Am I discerning with my mind - with reason and rationality - and not discerning with my heart ? That was her question.
Am I in my "head" too much when I do spiritual discernment, and not enough "in the Spirit"? Am I discerning with my mind - with reason and rationality - and not discerning with my heart?
It got me thinking. Since I'm involved in offering a reasonable defense for the faith and advocating clear thinking on critical issues, since I'm skeptical of those whose religion is almost entirely emotional/intuitive, people have challenged me that I'm only "half there" not using all my spiritual faculties and therefore am at risk of running into error.
"Koukl, you're just in your head too much," they suggest. "You're too left-brained when it comes to spiritual things. You're too logical, too reasonable. You don't depend enough on your heart to discern the spiritual realm. Yes you're using your mind, but what about your spirit? Why do you always trust in your own thinking instead of what the Spirit is saying about something?"
These statements imply that somehow I'm not doing a full-blooded assessment of things because I'm only using half of my machinery. My analysis should include the subjective, not just the objective.
This kind of critique assumes a couple of things. First, it assumes that there are two types of spiritual assessment. One is a rational assessment, a kind of theological head-trip. The other is a subjective, intuitive skill that some call discernment, in which we sense deep within us that something is on target or that something is amiss.
Second, it implies that the subjective, intuitive analysis is more advanced and more accurate. It is a "higher method," a more tuned-in capability. It's a spiritual assessment and not just a mental, rational assessment. It's an ability to "hear what the Spirit has to say."
People who make these kinds of comments generally are skeptical of the rational to begin with. It strikes them as being fleshly. It's what Koukl "brings to the table," so to speak, his mind, his thinking, his own rationality, his own ideas. And all of these smack of "the ways of the world," as opposed to going to God and letting God do the analysis for us.
This distinction is incredibly pervasive in Evangelical circles, so much so that some groups have even given a name to it. Some of the so-called Word-Faith teachers distinguish between what they call sensate knowledge --that which you learn with your mind as a result of study and analysis- -and revelational knowledge --that which is mediated directly to you in the spiritual realm. You have this learned stuff you get with your head, and you have this spiritual stuff you get from somewhere "out there," from the spiritual realm.
As I did a mental inventory of the New Testament, though, it suddenly occurred to me that I couldn't think of any verses at all that supported the notion of discernment as subjective and intuitive.
The second type is definitely better, the argument goes. You need to develop the capability to learn things spiritually so you can really get the deep truth, because the sensate stuff is distorted by the flesh. At least this is implied when you hear these kinds of assessments. And isn't it really true that Evangelicals trust more in their "spirits" than in their minds when it comes to spiritual things?
When I was less than a year old in Christ, I went to a coffeehouse in the basement of a church in Pacific Palisades in California. It was so long ago that Keith Green was not even a Christian yet (for those of you who remember that fine Christian musician who died in 1982 in a plane crash). Keith was there that night playing with Randy Stonehill, who eventually was to lead Keith to Christ. But Keith wasn't a believer that night.
As I entered the door that evening, my friend Joyce paused and put her hand to her chest as if she felt something. "Gosh, I sense that something is wrong. I feel this check in my spirit," she said. And I thought, I can't wait till I get to the point in my spiritual growth where I can know things directly in the spiritual realm, and have this sixth sense and discern things like Joyce just did.
It's 23 years later and I still haven't gotten that sixth sense. Instead, I use my mind. I don't say that as a concession, like I got the last place prize. I think it's biblical. The only way to know if I'm correct, though, is to ask the questions, "Which way is really right? Which is best? Do we discern with our minds, or do we need a sixth sense for optimum spiritual discernment?"
When I was challenged this week, my first response was, "I bet if you do a scriptural analysis, you'll find there are more verses that have to do with an objective assessment than those for a subjective one." I figured that if there really are two different ways of discernment, no one could fault me for being rational if I had scriptural support, especially if more verses supported a objective method than a subjective one.
As I did a mental inventory of the New Testament, though, it suddenly occurred to me that I couldn't think of any verses at all that supported the notion of discernment as subjective and intuitive. None came to mind, so I had to do a little searching.
I went to my NASB Bible Master program and started looking up words, starting with the word "discern." There are only two verses in the New Testament that even use the word. In Matthew 16:3 Jesus says that in the morning, "...[you say] 'There will be a storm today, for the sky is red and threatening.' Do you know how to discern the appearance of the sky, but cannot discern the signs of the times?"
Jesus was talking about looking at particular signs - the appearance of the sky - and drawing conclusions about what the weather will be like. That's an objective, not a subjective, assessment.
The point is, when the Bible talks about discernment - when it talks about assessing spiritual things - it's talking about a rational assessment based on objective criterion.
Hebrews 5:14 chastised those who ought to have been teachers of the Word, eating meat instead of drinking milk. Then it says, "...but solid food is for the mature, who because of practice have their senses trained to discern good and evil." So the discernment here is not subjective; it's objective. It's using the knowledge and practice of the truth of the Scriptures to develop an ability to objectively discern right from wrong.
Then I looked up the word "discernment." There's only one use of it, Philippians 1:9-10. It says, "...this I pray, that your love may abound still more and more in real knowledge and all discernment, so that you may approve the things that are excellent, in order to be sincere and blameless until the day of Christ."
Here, discernment is coupled with knowledge resulting in a morally excellent life. Discernment is knowing what's right and what's wrong. We get that from the Scriptures, as Hebrews 5:14 points out. Sounds like an objective assessment to me.
Then I looked up the word "test." There are fifteen verses that use this word, but only one that applies to our issue. In I John 5:1-3 it says: "Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because there are many false prophets gone out into the world." Now we're getting warmer, I thought, testing the spirits. Surely now we're moving into subjective.
Not so. Read again. The next verse says, "By this you know the spirit of God. Every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God." Hmm...not a subjective test here, but an objective one, once again.
First Corinthians 12:10 talks about spiritual gifts. Here we might be on to something, because distinguishing of spirits is a spiritual gift. There is no hint of objective standards here; there's also no hint of subjective standards. In fact, what's curious about this verse is that it doesn't say anything else in this passage, nor anywhere else, about what it means to distinguish spirits.
I'm inclined to believe that since it's a spiritual gift, it leans more toward a subjective ability, because if this were referring to an objective way to distinguish spirits, we all could do it, and we wouldn't need the gift. So here seems to be one verse that lends itself to a subjective sense of discernment, but it's not something that everybody has, only those who are gifted. If I'm not gifted in this way, then there's no point in me trying to distinguish spirits subjectively, because I have different gifts.
Next I looked up the word "correct," but there were no entries. I looked up the word "correcting" and found II Timothy 2:25, "...with gentleness, correcting those who are in opposition, if perhaps God may grant them repentance leading to the knowledge of the truth." Here the correcting has to do with having a conflict with people who disagree with you. The verse above it says, "...not being argumentative, but gracious when wronged, with gentleness correcting..." Once again we have an objective test. We see that somebody is doing something wrong and we offer correction. No intuitive pondering here or getting into a spiritual twilight zone. Rather a correction "leading to the knowledge of the truth." The truth is objective.
Here's my point. Is it true that Koukl is too much into his head, using his reason to assess spiritual things, and is not into the Spirit enough? Only if the Bible teaches that we must balance the two. But when I asked the question, "Where does the Bible teach such a thing?" I found no such teaching. I was unable to produce any scriptural support except for I Corinthians 12:10 about the distinguishing of spirits, which is a spiritual gift I have not been given, apparently, and which only a few have.
The point is, when the Bible talks about discernment - when it talks about assessing spiritual things - it's talking about a rational assessment based on objective criterion. You can't be "too much in your head" when it comes to spiritual discernment. Using your head is spiritual discernment, if you're using the truth properly.
I believe when G-d speaks to me, it is revealed through the Holy Spirit, which is in tune with my spirit, that is the only way we can receive revelation from G-d, because he is Spirit.
I believe He reveals himself through the His Holy Word and the only reason I can discern it is through my spirit. Like Elisha said our hearts are deceitful and desperately wicked, who can know it?
Our minds are influenced by the world, our flesh,our emotions, which can all lead us astray, however, when we become more like Him and meditate on His Word, we can overcome our own mind and have the "mind of christ" it is only as we submit to Him and die to self and our earthly nature that we become more spiritual and spirit-filled. We have to empty ourselves to be filled with Holy Spirit.
The Lord's Word is indiscernible without the Holy Spirit's revealing of it. 1 Cor 2:14
Everything must be filtered through His written Word to be sure it is of Him and not ourselves or Satan.
If someone says the Lord revealed something to them and it does line up with Scripture, then we know it is a lie and not of the Lord.
If someone says the Lord revealed something to them and it does line up with Scripture, then it may or may not be directly revealed to them from the Lord. There is no way to be absolutely sure and certainly no way to prove it. That is between them and the Lord and should probably be kept that way.
The topic is how to discern, head or heart?
Assuming one has been born again, they would discern by prayerfully studying and meditating on His written Word.
Hey there Shalom:waving: So glad to see you back with us for however long you will stay:yay:... missed you!
Good word you have spoken, but it seems somebody hasn't been baptized with the Holy Spirit to know the difference. As believers in Christ we all are filled, but the to be baptized in /with the Holy Spirit we come into the knowledge of who God is through Jesus Christ, and learn and know that God is Spirit and we must communicate with Him in our spirit to His Spirit.
Paul teahces us to RENEW OUR MINDS, which means to have the same mind that is in Christ, becasue when we have truly been BAPTIZED in the pwoer of the Holy Spirit, we no long THINK with our finite minds, but we are LED BY the HOLY SPIRIT to receive what God is giving us.
Our spirit is to be in control over what we THINK IN OUR MINDS, but the natural man and carnal man as James is expressing, can't understand these thing, because they are SPPIRUALLY DISCERNED THROUGH OUR spirit that has now become the mind of Christ, because we know that Jesus Christ IS SPIRIT, AND HIS PSIRIT IN IN CONTROL IN OUR LIFE, and Christ IS THE SPIRIT THAT NOW LIVES on th inside of us.
Therefore, our spirit takes on the Spirt of Christ, and Paul instruct us to know therefore, WALK IN THE SPIRIT AND HAVE THE MIND OF CHRIST THAT NOW LIVES ON THE INSIDE OF US, which has become OUR NEW NATURE... we are now BORN AGAIN OF A NEW NATURE THAT IS FOUND IN CHRIST, no longer the OLD NATURE OR OLD PERSON BEFORE BEING BAPTIZED INTO CHIRST BORN AGAIN FROM ABOVE with a new mind which is controlled by ournew spirit which is the SPIRIT OF CHIRST, who has now also become our being... we are no longer the same, but are now new creations in Christ born of His Holy Spirit.
But as Paul says, the natural man who has NOT BEEN BORN AGAIN, WHICH MEANS BAPTIZED IN THE HOLY SPIRIT and is lead by the HOLY SPIRIT and communicates WITH THE HOLY SPRIT Spirit to spirit DOES NOT UNDERSTAND OR ACCEPTS THESE THINGS BECAUSE THE PERSON HAS NOT BEEN BAPTIZED or washed or cleansed from his old nature in his old spirit, and will therefore, continue to THINK WITH HIS CARNAL MIND TRYING TO UNDERSTAND AND DISCERN THE THINGS OF GOD...
We come into the knowledge of God's word in the scrptures NOT WITH OUR CARNAL OR NATURAL MIND, BUT THEY ARE REVEALED TO US THROUGH THE HOLY SPIRIT COMMUNICATING TO US IN OUR SPIRIT WHAT GOD IS SPEAKING...
We worship and communicate with God in our spirit in connection to HIS SPIRIT. Our spirit is to be in control over our minds, this is the NEW CREATED AMN IN CHIRST... but when a person allows their MIND TO BE IN CONTROL OVER THEIR ACTIOSN AND THINKING PROCESS, THIS PERSON HAS NOT BEEN TRULY BORN AGAIN OF THE/BY THE HOLY SPIRIT OF GOD... This is all a part of the REGENERATION PROCESS WHEN THE HOLY SPIRIT REGENERATES, WHICH MEANS CHANGE US, OR WASHES US OR CLEANSE US FROM OUR OLD THOUGHTS AND CARNAL OR NATURAL SIN NATURE, AND GIVE US (BAOPTIZE US INTO THE MIND OF CHIRST GIVING US THE NATURE OR MIND, a NEW HEAVENLY SPIRIT THAT IS ONLY FOUND IN CHRIST. Our old nature (spirit) is changed to a new nature spirit, which is the mind of Christ, or it is called having the SPIRIT OF CHRIST.
It is the Holy Spirit who ministers to us in our spirit to DISCERN, good from evil, right from worng... not our minds, of course, that is if a person is born again... and is taught by the Spirit to know the difference...
We also discern with our eyes, our ears, and make the CHOICES through our spirits as to what to do or path to take or what is right or wrong, good or evil... But it is ONLY the Holy Spirit who communicates this to us in our spirit to perceive these things.
Its either our spirit in control over our minds, or our minds in control over our spirit...
Whatsoever a person thinks in his/her heart, this is what he/she is, means whatsoever a person thinks in his or her spirit (heart) about him/herself this is who or what he/she is... why is this?.. you ask, because the person who is SPIRIT filled, is led by the Spirit and will think or have the heart of Christ according to what God tells the person he/she is, based on the Word of God... a person who is not SPIRT filled and thinks with his/her MIND will be led by his/her own thoughts of the mind, and will THINK more highly of him/herself than they ought about him/herself, which is outside of of God.
For if a man think himself to be something, when he is nothing, he deceiveth himself. Galatians 6:3
Proverbs 23: 6 Do not eat the bread of a miser, Nor desire his delicacies; For as he thinks in his heart (spirit), so is he. � Eat and drink!� he says to you, But his heart is not with you. The morsel you have eaten, you will vomit up, And waste your pleasant words.
Commentary Proverbs 23:7 - John Gills - For as he thinketh in his heart, so [is] he� He is not the man his mouth speaks or declares him to be, but what his heart thinks; which is discovered by his looks and actions, and by which he is to be judged of, and not by his words; eat and drink, saith he to thee, but his heart [is] not with thee; he bids you eat and drink, but he does not desire you should, at least but very sparingly; it is only a mere compliment, not a hearty welcome.
COMMENTARY Proverbs 23:7 by Matthew Henry -Observe, 1. There are those that pretend to bid their friends welcome that are not hearty and sincere in it. They have a fair tongue, and know what they should say: Eat and drink, saith he, because it is expected that the master of the feast should so compliment his guests; but they have an evil eye, and grudge their guests every bit they eat, especially if the eat freely. They would seem to be liberal in making the entertainment, and would have the credit of it, but they have so great a love to their money, and so little to their friends, that they cannot have the comfort of it, nor any enjoyment of themselves or their friends. The miser's feast is his penance.
If a man be so very selfish, and sordid, and mean that he cannot find in his heart to bid his friends welcome to what he has, he ought not to add to that the guilt of dissimulation by inviting them, but let him own himself to be what he is, that the vile person may not be called liberal nor the churl bountiful, Isaiah 32:5. 2. One can have no comfort in accepting the entertainments that are given grudgingly: "Eat not thou the bread of such a man; let him keep it to himself. Do not sponge upon those that are bountiful, nor make thyself burdensome to any; but especially scorn to be beholden to those that are paltry and not sincere. Better have a dinner of herbs, and true welcome, than dainty meats without it.
Therefore," (1.) "Judge of the man as his mind is. Thou thinkest to pay thy respect to him as a friend, so thou takest him to be, because he compliments thee, but as he thinks in his heart so is he, not as he speaks with his tongue." We are that really, both to God and man, which we are inwardly; and neither religion nor friendship is worth any thing further than as it is sincere.
(2.) "Judge of the meat as the digestion is and as it agrees with thee. He bids thee eat freely, but, first or last, he will discover his sordid covetous humour, and as he thinks in his heart so will he look, and give thee to understand that thou art not welcome, and then the morsel thou hast eaten thou shalt vomit up; the very thought of that will make thee even to vomit the meat thou hast eaten, and eat the words thou has spoken in returning his compliments and giving him thanks for his civilities. Thou shalt lose thy sweet words, which he has given thee and thou has given him."
Eze 36:24 For I will take you from among the heathen, and gather you out of all countries, and will bring you into your own land.
Eze 36:25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.
Eze 36:26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
1st Peter 3:4 But let it be the hidden man of the heart, in that which is not corruptible, even the ornament of a meek and quiet spirit, which is in the sight of God of great price.
The word of God illustrates the Heart and Mind are separate
Mr 12:30 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.
Lu 10:27 And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself.
Here is another picture of the division of man's being
Heb 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
1Th 5:23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
The Soul of man is his Mind, Will, and Emotions:
James 1:21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.
Well one thing is clear PJ and what my point was is that your mind and your brain ae not the same things, your mind is way more than your intelect and where you store wordly fleshly knowleg, those thngs are in your brain your mins is much more than that and I am pretty sure your mind is not one seperate thing but made up of the seperate things that make you who you are on the inside, including intelect, emotions , and spirit thats my understanding or maybe I can explain it the way I see it, but like I said my biggest point was in reference to this article your brain and your mind are not the same things, your heart and your mind are not so seperate! And also the bible does say the heart is decietful, now PJ you know that the flesh wars against the spirit one is contrary to the other!! Right? So yes we have a new heart! But the flesh does not disapear not until the coruptable puts on incoruption! Then we will not have the potential of a decieful heart any longer! until then we have "the spirit man" and "the flesh man" these 2 are in conflict they both live within us and they are at war! They both have a heart and the heart in the man of flesh is decietful and wicked! The heart in our spirit man is clean and full of Christ Jesus, when we starve our flesh and crucify it then is decreases and our spirit man increases and the more we die to flesh the closer our walk with the Lord is but not only must we starve our flesh but we must feed the Spirit man with the Word of the Lord and prayer and worship and praise and assembling those things are food for the spirit and the more we feed him the more he grows the bigger he is the smaller the flesh or carnal man is!
So the heart is decitful the carnal heart that is! and if we are not crucifiing the carnal man then he will get bigger than the spirit man that is when our hearts will decieve us!
We see this in some of the peoile who believe false doctrines, you see they dont die to sin and their own flesh, they feed their flesh with the things of this world money, sex even ungodly things on television makes the flesh grow into a giant nasty rotten flesh monster that gobbels up our spirit man.. But back to my point! What I was saying about the people who believe the lies of false doctrines, they are conditoned to believe lies becasue they are more flesh than they are spirit it is common sence! If you feed the flesh and starve the spirit then the flesh grows and the spirit dies and if you feed your spirit and starve your flesh then your spirit grows and your flesh shrinks and dies, the flesh however is never completly dead it is still there maybe teeny tiney but waiting for you to feed him just a crumb even something small like listening to country or rock music, that makes him a little bigger. Do that for a little while then you might start watching an ungodlty show on television!1 Do that for alittle while you might decide it is ok to spend the weekend in biloxi mississippi gambling and drinking so long as you make it back in time for sunday service! Keep on going till you think it is ok to go to the bar on friday night just so long as you dont go sturday wouldnt want to still smell like ber at church on sunday! And such is how the flesh becomes so big it gobbels up your spirit man til he is just barly there and the only way to get back to where you were is to start starving the flesh again and feeding your spirit. But by thgen you feel like a failure and the devil is steady yeling at you that you are a failure and that everyone is t you and they all know you will never be able to live a Christian life, you bide as well give up and just live life to its fullest, drink all you want have iilicit sex and habg out in bars heclk start smoking crack becasue all is lost anyway, you will nevr get back to the place you were before walking so close to the Lord and living alife of hillieness and sepearted from the world for the Lord! Does any of that make sence to yall?
thats how I see it and I know it was a bit off the subject I wanted to adress what PJ said about the heart not being decieful
t you and they all know you will never be able to live a Christian life, you bide as well give up and just live life to its fullest, drink all you want have iilicit sex and habg out in bars heclk start smoking crack becasue all is lost anyway, you will nevr get back to the place you were before walking so close to the Lord and living alife of hillieness and sepearted from the world for the Lord! Does any of that make sence to yall?