Author	Thread: Two ways of understanding or one.
Admin	Two ways of understanding or one. Posted : 31 Jul, 2010 08:17 PM Hello everyone: I think most Christians have heard this Scripture either spoken,or taught upon at some point in their lives. Matt 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. What is Yeshua/Jesus saying to Peter,the disciples,and then to the body of believers. Remember as the Scripture is read,this is not written in English,but in Greek; Spoken in Hebrew or Ariamaic,being understood by Hebrew men. With that being said,try understanding this as a Hebrew man would understand this. Please be a thinking person,not one that just reads what someone else has written about this,That person just might be wrong. Agape' and Charis: St.George Post Reply
View Profile History	Two ways of understanding or one. Posted : 1 Aug, 2010 11:37 AM George I would like to to make a couple points here that are clear in scripture, of course tools will help those that are diligent in there studies in the word of God. Even though we are not Jew or Gentile it is the same with the lord, the answer for those that want to know Truth is just as the lord Jesus said, it is in Acts 2:4, the gift of the Holy Ghost. George you will not find in scripture the statement that agrees with please be a thinker or think this thought out. Man does not contact God with his mind, nor will ever commune with God thru his mind and resasoning faculties. God is a Spirit, he is not a mind. Post Reply
View Profile History	Two ways of understanding or one. Posted : 1 Aug, 2010 02:48 PM PJ: We are not told to leave our minds outside on the porch. To be able to meditate upon the Scriptures includes using ones mind. But I thought you would know this seeing that you have such a tremendous grasp of the Scriptures,and a command of the languages which the Word has been written into. I was hoping you would have mentioned what this Scripture is about,instead of being your usual critical self. Maybe all I should expect of you is to be critical,about everyone and everything people write about here. Even those who want to encourage you unto Love,Faith and Good works. Agape' and Charis: St.George Post Reply
View Profile History	Two ways of understanding or one. Posted : 1 Aug, 2010 04:00 PM (I) think... He (Jesus) was saying he would build his church upon "revelation knowlege of who He was." Post Reply
View Profile History	Two ways of understanding or one. Posted : 1 Aug, 2010 04:44 PM Matt 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. Peter = Rock in greek. This would be understood to mean that upon Peter Christs church will be built not that Peter was infallible. Post Reply
View Profile History	Two ways of understanding or one. Posted : 1 Aug, 2010 04:58 PM If the church is to be built upon Peter,when was peter rejected according to the Scriptures. Matt 21:42 Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes? Remember when understanding the Scriptures,there is a subject and an object. Who or what is the subject,and who or what is the object. Agape' and Charis: George Post Reply
View Profile History	Two ways of understanding or one. Posted : 1 Aug, 2010 05:13 PM What is your point to jumping a good distance into the future and a few chapters later in the Bible? Post Reply
DontHitThatMark View Profile History	Two ways of understanding or one. Posted : 2 Aug, 2010 09:10 AM I think Jesus was saying that anyone who confesses that Jesus is the Son of God will be the rock on which He will build His kingdom. Not specifically Peter. And I find it a little funny that some churches claim this verse as the base for their "papal" theology and then in the same chapter... Mathew 16:23But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men. 24Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. So "Peter the first Pope" is someone who cares more about the things of men than the things of God. It's just a little ironic. To me anyway:laugh:. :peace::peace: Post Reply
View Profile History	Two ways of understanding or one. Posted : 2 Aug, 2010 10:35 AM There are two things to point out here. First of all it is good to note that Jesus often enjoyed using a play on words to illustrate his point. In this case he has already renamed Simon as Cephas (of Peter) which means stone. In this situation Peter recognized that jesus is the Messiah. Jesus in return recognizes Peter as a stone. This may have been more of a reflection of Peter's character than his true name Simon which means 'hearer" . It is obvious that Peter had behaved more like a stone than like a hearer up to this point. The "rock" in this case has to be a reference to a cornerstone. It was and is common knowledge that a building has to have a solid, square, and plum corner stone in order for it to stand properly and last a good long time. The church is entirely built upon the cornerstone of the Truth that Jesus is the Messiah, sent by the Father to save creation. Without this Truth the entire thing is nothing more than a pile of rocks waiting for a time to collapse. Instead the church has endured persecution from inside and outside, it cannot be destroyed nor can the Truth of our Messiah upon whom it is built. I also think it is imperative that we keep in mind that it is likely that Jesus did not think of the church, the called out ones, as we think of the Church today. What if this were translated, "and upon the Truth that I am the Messiah I will build up those whom I have called out"? Jesus is not a builder of organizations He is a Builder of Men as was his step-father, Joseph, and as is His Father in heaven. Thunder Post Reply
View Profile History	Two ways of understanding or one. Posted : 2 Aug, 2010 11:03 AM The topic is building, and when one builds it must be a solid foundation, so what are believers to build upon? The Revelation of the word of God, the lord Jesus. Mat 7:24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock: 25 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock. 26 And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand: 27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it. 28 And it came to pass, when Jesus had ended these sayings, the people were astonished at his doctrine: 29 For he taught them as one having authority, and not as the scribes. Post Reply
View Profile History	Two ways of understanding or one. Posted : 2 Aug, 2010 05:09 PM Hello everyone: In this Word of Yeshua/Jesus;what does 'IT' refer to. Is this 'It" referring to the church: Or to Yehsua/Jesus building His Church. Mat 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. How would one stop the church from being built. Are the so-called church growth programs of the Lord; If those programs are of the Lord,then why do we need Yeshua to build the Church Agape' and Charis: St.George Post Reply

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