Thread: Is The Missionary Program found in Demoninations Necessary in Light of God's Word?
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Is The Missionary Program found in Demoninations Necessary in Light of God's Word?
Posted : 18 Mar, 2010 11:52 AM
Should believers, that is those who are born again and have a living relationship with Christ be involved with Missionary work or programs relating to such works?
My answer will surprise most everyone. The answer is a resounding no! Nowhere in scripture to we find where anyone is commanded to be a missionary.
I also realize many to prove God's authority for missionary work are going to use Matthew 28:190-20 when Christ told His 11 disciples to go into the world, ect. I'll give it as shown below.
Matthew 28:19 �Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
20 �Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.
Also more of this commission is found in Mark 16:14-18 and this rounds out with more detail, what this commission is all about.
Mark 16:14 �Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen.
15 �And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
16 �He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
17 �And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
18 �They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.
There are several reasons why this commission is not for today. One, the signs that shall follow them that believe shall cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
they shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.
Secondly, no signs no commission. Also to back up the fact there is no commission is because Paul said they fulfilled it. Proof:
Colossians 1:23 �If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;
Third, this commission was not in connection with the church at all. It was in connection with Christ offering Israel their promised Kingdom on earth with Christ reining for a thousand years. Another subject for another time.
Also when we are in God's truth, God will bring people to us to witness to. {MY words}
Since no direct reference is made concerning missionaries as done today here is what is said in God's word.
Romans 10:17 �So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
Romans 14:23 �And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.
Also God's word says we don't have to know of Christ to be saved.
Romans 1:20 �For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse.
Fourth, God's spirit is in the world convicting man of sin.
John 16:7 ��Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.
8 �And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:
9 �Of sin, because they believe not on me;
The bottom line is that God has the responsibility dealing with everyone's relationship or lack of one with the Lord. God will certainly use whoever he wants but no is lost for lack of witness from a missionary.
Is The Missionary Program found in Demoninations Necessary in Light of God's Word?
Posted : 18 Mar, 2010 03:03 PM
Hi Gary,
I think you should know that the very scripture passages you have used to try and denounce the call for missionaries, has in fact contradicted your effort. You can't use God's word to denounce His word. Plus, He will not allow such... Sorry...:zzzz:
First, Matthew chapter 28:19-29, describes the missions call to ALL WHO BELIEVE IN THE LORD JESUS CHRIST:
(1) Go!
(2) Teach
(3) Baptize
Matthew verse 20 explains for us what is to be taught:
(1) Teaching them (who is "them?") the lost), to observe ALL THINGS (WHAT THINGS?)... ALL THINGS WHATSOEVER i HAVE COMMANDED YOU! (So what things did Jesus command the disciples and all believers?) This can be found throughout the books of the gospels, all of the teaching of Jesus Christ.
Also, Romans chapter 1: verse 20 Does NOT tell us that we don't need to know of Christ to be saved, as you have so wrongly stated. This verse tells us that we don't have need for anyone to tell us that there is a God to believe, because everything that God is can be found in His creations because they are "CLEARLY SEEN, BEING MADE, BY GOD'S ETERNAL POWER." Man can't create or make what God has made or created. Therefore, earthly man is WITHOUT EXCUSE FOR NOT BELIEVING IN THE MUGHITY POWER OF GOD OUR CREATOR OR HIS EXISTANCE... For the fool says in his heart, there is NO GOD!... therefore, Paul explains that God has shown Himself in His creation of the invisiable and the visable that there is a God, so man is without excuse for not believing, due to rebellion and hardheartedness.
How in the world you gather these scriptures to try an denounce the call for missions work, is beyond my understanding.
I think you have need to look up the meaning of the word COM-MISSSION, the word its self denotes missions work. And while you're at it, look up the word MISSION...
Also, it may do you well to re-read or it may be the case, that you have need to READ the book of Acts and seek the Holy Spirit to help you in comprehending what is going on here in this book and the work of the apostles.Especially, as it pretains to Pauls first missions trip and the beginning of his ministry.Starting at Acts chapter 13, Paul's first mission call to GO, TEACH, AND BAPTIZE.
Also, why would you attach missions work as being a part of a denomination? Missions work is what EVERY believer is called to do, regardless, OF YOUR DENOMINATION, unless of course, you have another word or definition for the meaning of "GO", or being "SENT FORTH"...
I AM PROUD TO BE A MISSIONARY CALLED BY GOD, and I am very passionate about my call, and I refuse to allow anyone to denounce the missions work God has called me to do, and all believers to do for that matter. I think maybe if you would take time to put the firt word of the Commission to "GO" into action in your community, and GO about helping those in need around you, you will have a better understanding of what it means to be a MISSIONARY.
I rather understand, and it never fails, its usually the ones who are not doing the works of the ministry who always try to find fault in what God has called believers to do...
Please know you may not like what I say, just as I don't like how you have tried to denunce the call of the missionary wrongly dividing the word of God to try and fit it to your own personal beliefs. But I am speaking my peace about the matter of your post, as you are in correct, and I have no problems pointing out your error, as is my responsibility to do as a believer. :yay::peace:
Is The Missionary Program found in Demoninations Necessary in Light of God's Word?
Posted : 18 Mar, 2010 06:14 PM
dear folks, hello again tom lane...aka gary thomas ..
miss ella i for one praise GOD for you and the minsirty you do for HIM..
i for one also believe that a missionary of any denomination is a good thing..
isnt missionary work to spread the gospel of JESUS CHRIST and also to help those in need or less fortunate than others?
correct me if i am wrong folks but thats what ive always heard that missionary work is about..
miss ella you keep workin them front lines .. dont pay no mind what others say .. as you and the good LORD know the deal. im sure you arent doin it to get recognition from any man anyways.. so it really doesnt matter what anyone else thinks of your ministry.. though if you want my input i think its a wonderful thing you do..
i never really heard anyone speak ill of a ministry of helping others as a bad thing before.. wow is all i can say ..
Is The Missionary Program found in Demoninations Necessary in Light of God's Word?
Posted : 19 Mar, 2010 06:46 AM
No Gary the word missionary isnt in the bible. so your saying because the word isnt there that the ministry musnt be.
I think you should re-read what ella wrote. she explained it well by breaking down the word commission.
also, the word trinity isnt in the bible either, but you believe in the Father Son and Holy Spirit, don't you?
So to answer your question, yes I believe it's necessary because of the great commission. Missionaries can do more than you and I will probably ever do, because that is what they do on a full time basis. They give up their families and jobs and their own lives to do the work of the Lord. to love others and win them over to Christ. Isnt that our goal as christians? I can think of several examples of missionary works that are going on right now that are stepping into 3rd world countries and making a huge difference for the honor and glory of God. building orphanages and giving children whose parents have died from aids or absent for some reason hope for the future, food on the tables, clothes on their back, community, education, love and Jesus.
For someone to question these people's motives that lay their lives down is a matter of their own heart. Is it beating Gary? Where is your compassion, who will go? I believe missionaries are an extension of God's heart to those that may never hear the gospel otherwise. No television, no radio...who would reach them?
Is The Missionary Program found in Demoninations Necessary in Light of God's Word?
Posted : 19 Mar, 2010 07:04 AM
God is not handicapped that he needs a program like missionaries. If he did He would have instructed as such in His word. I also believe if we go here and there of our own will or because of some program, we would be running ahead of the Lord.
The Lord is very capable of using his wherever he wants for we are told to await upon the Lord.
He has also told he His word thoroughly furnishes us unto all good works that will honor Him.
2 Timothy 3:16 �All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17 �That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
Of course since missionary work is not mentioned in scripture not many want to bother obeying God's word in regards to what God says if it does not fit in with man's philosophies and works programs.
God is going to judge us one day according to His word and if what we do religiously is not found with in His word and applies to this present time we are in then it will be sin because God has said so.
We worship God by faith and our faith has to be found in His word. Not because it is part of a sectarian doctrine.
Romans 10:17 �So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
God has also told us if it is not of faith, that is if it is not found in His word it amounts to sin.
Romans 14:23 �And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.
In regards to using the commission found in Matthew and Mark that was given to the 11 apostles as instructed by Christ and not to the church. The church was not even in existence yet. This commission was in regards to God still offering the Kingdom {Christ's thousand year rein on earth} and had nothing to do with the Church. Both Jew and Gentile are made a new creation we later found out after The Lord has the temple torn down to show us he has set that program aside for the time being. God's time clock has stopped.
The church was a mystery and seems to still be to so many who cannot rightly divide what belongs to Israel and what belongs to the church that is Christ's body. Even the Law and all its fleshly ordinances have been set aside.
We find in Romans the 11th chapter where Israel has been set aside until the time of the Gentiles.
Romans 11:25 �For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
Also during this age of grace we are no longer under fleshly ordinances of any kind. To name a few, water baptism, Sabbath keeping, tithing.
Ephesians 2:14 ��For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
15 �Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
16 �And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
The us being Jews and both meaning both Jew and Gentile. Please notice it says the middle wall of partition, {the the law} has been broken down. In Col. 2:14-17 the law is referred to as being nailed to the cross.}. Please also noticed verse 15, it says: Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances. We are under grace we are not under any kind of ordinance such as water baptism. For there is only one baptism. That baptism is spirit baptism because it is done by God.
Proof: Colossians 2:12 �Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.
Wouldn't you rather be buried with Christ as opposes being buried like Him? No where in scripture do we find we are to be buried like Him but with Him. Since all ordinances have been abolished there is now only one baptism and that would have to be spiritual baptism.
Is The Missionary Program found in Demoninations Necessary in Light of God's Word?
Posted : 19 Mar, 2010 07:45 AM
Great points River of Life, Cattleman, Philip... I personally think Gary has a problem with words, and in his interpretation and understanding of what he is reading in the Bible. This I see in his post, it is filled with confusion of scriptures that he has put together to try and make his point about missionaries not being necessary.:prayingf::prayingm:
First, Gary, I would like to ask you a few questions:
(1) By whose authority was Jesus sent to earth?
(2) what was His purpose for coming to earth?
(3) Did He accomplish His purpose?
(4) When a person is SENT to do something, what is this called?
By the authority of Jesus Christ, ALL believers have been SENT FORTH/COMMISSIONED to GO out in to ALL the world(the world in meaning also means your communities, your homes and all places you would not find meaningful), with the gospel of Jesus Christ.
Gary, We read in Matthew chapter 10, that Jesus SENT forth His disciples, so what was the purpose, and why did He send them, and again, what was it called when Jesus sent them forth? Was there any particular thing or task they were to accomplish? What is being sent forth called?... to rescue and save is called what?...
Also, Since you did not complete the verses connecting to verese 17, in Romans chapter 10:verse 17 which you quoted. I will do it for you. I think this is where you have gotten lost, using many scriptures that have nothing to do with your topic about missionaries. Many confused people tend to misquote and read only half of a verse, and miss out on what is really being said in the whole passage.
You only quoted verse 17, so here is what it has to say, maybe your bible doesn't cover these verses, so I will share with you what my Bible has to say, leading up to verse 17 which you quoted to try and prove your rambling point..
Romans chapter 10, starting at verses 13-17: For whoever calls upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
Verses 14-15: How then shall they call on Him(Jesus Christ) in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear without a precher? And how shall they preach...(now this is what you're missing and must understand)... UNLESS THEY ARE SENT? As it is written: How beautiful are the feet of THOSE who preach the gospel of peace, who BRING glad tidings(GOOD NEWS) of good things.
Verses 16-17: But they have not all obeyed the gospel for Isaiah says: Lord, who has believed our report?... Now here is the verse you quoted in an effort to prove your statement: So then faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God.
Question to you Gary, How can one hear the word of God, UNLESS someone is SENT. Therefore, what is there to be accomplished when a person is SENT? And again what is it called when a person or group of people are SENT FORTH? Its called misssionary work! Unless, of course, you have a better word for this...
Also, while I'm at it. John 16: verse 7, is speaking about the MINISTRY WORK OR MISSION of the Holy Spirit, wherein He causes a person to understand and see clearly the truth of God's word. God has not commissioned believers to this work, He has SENT us to do the mission work of speading the Good News about Jesus Christ and to help those in spiritual need of salvation and help physical needs of people .
It is the missions ministry and work of the Holy Spirit to convict people of their sins, not our's. All we've been commanded to do is Go and preach the word to the lost!
We can't save anybody nor convict anyone of their sins. I can see, that You're not rightly dividing the word of God, in the use of the scriptures you use. Therefore, I undersatnd why it is that you are not able to comprehend the call to GO and being sent forth as being missions work, nor do you understand that those who are sent forth are called MISSIONARIES. I also see that you don't understand the meaning of the word missions or missionaries... I didn't coin the words, but it is in relationship to what the CALL and command given to us is all about.
But as I said, try going forth in your community, for a better understanding of what it is you're called to do as a Christian Believers.
BTW, what denomination are you, in that , you don't believe in missionaries? And who are/is your spiritual teacher (s).Or, are you teaching and leading yourself?... even cults do missionary work:glow::yay::ROFL::party:
