Thread: Zionists Helped To Spread Dispensationalism
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Zionists Helped To Spread Dispensationalism
Posted : 29 Jun, 2011 11:21 AM
Zionists Helped To Spread Dispensationalism
In 1936, Lewis S. Chafer, a classical dispensationalist, defined Scofield's literalism as "The outstanding characteristic of the dispensationalist is ... that he believes every statement of the Bible and gives to it the plain, natural meaning its words imply."
From: L. S. Chafer, �Dispensationalism,� Bibliotheca Sacra, 93, October (1936), pp410, 417.
Charles C. Ryrie (born 1925) says of classical dispensationalism that the: "basic primise of Dispensationalism
is two purposes of God expressed in the formation of two peoples who maintain their distinction throughout eternity." Charles C. Ryrie, Dispensationalism Today, 1966,pp.44-45.
J. Dwight Pentecost is another dispensationalist theologian who in his book Things To Come ( 1965) says "The church and Israel are two distinct groups with whom God has a divine plan. The church is a mystery, unrevealed in the Old Testament." (page 193, J. Dwight Pentecost, Things To Come, Zondervan, 1965)....
The classical dispensationalists - John Darby, C.I. Scofield, and Lewis S. Chafer - insist that "Israel" in the Old
Testament always means physical or ethnic Israel, the descendants of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. And - the Catholic Church did not replace ethnic Israel. Ethnic Israel was reborn in Jesus Christ. It was transformed rather than replaced.
The teaching of this theology is that God has two different peoples, the Jews and the Church, with whom he deals in very different ways.
Scripture does not support this teaching. Christ in John 10: 16 says "And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd."
He says clearly that there shall be one fold of his people, not two.
John 1: 11 says "He came unto his own, and his own received him not." As a consequence, Matthew 8: 11-12 says "And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven. But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth."
Paul in Ephesians 2: 13-15 says "But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;"
Christ broke down the wall separating believing Jews from believing Gentiles, and made them one. They are not two different groups under Christ.
"So we, being many, are one body in Christ, and every one members one of another" (Romans 12: 5).
" For we being many are one bread, and one body: for we are all partakers of that one bread" (I Corinthians 10: 17).
"There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus." Galatians 3: 28)
"There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;" (Ephesians 4: 4)
Paul was careful to tell his congregations that Jewish and Gentile Christians were of one body and not two separate groups. This concern of Paul came partly out of the problem he faced of Judaizers telling his Gentile Christians that they must follow the ceremonial law of Moses to be saved, that is. they were trying to mix the Old and New Covenants together into a false religion.
C.I. Scofield was the American who spread dispensationalism in the United States during the late 19th century and early 20th century. But there is some evidence that later on members of the Zionist movement helped to spread dispensationalism, especially in the United States. Certainly dispensationalism as the most popular theology in American evangelical churches has encouraged Christians to donate money to the cause of the nation of Israel, and to support efforts by the government to protect Israel in military, economic and political ways.
For example, Samuel Untermeyer, who later became chairman of the American Jewish Committee, and president
of the American League of Jewish Patriots. is said to have helped C.I Scofield, the first major American dispensationalists. This is from the site:
"Untermeyer introduced Scofield to numerous Zionist and socialist
leaders, including Samuel Gompers, Fiorello LaGuardia, Abraham Straus, Bernard Baruch and Jacob Schiff. These were the people who financed Scofield's research trips to Oxford and arranged the publication and
distribution of his concordance."
Scofield passed the promotion of dispensationalism on to Lewis Sperry Chafer who founded the Dallas Theological Seminary in 1924. The theology was spread from there and soon from other theological seminaries after 1924. So dispensationalism
is a set of false doctrines that have been spread to the churches from the theological seminaries.
I suppose one could label me as a dispensationalist as I believe there is a plan for National Israel separate from that of the Church, both laid out in Scripture. And while not all dispensationalist's are Zionist Christians, I consider myself a Zionist Christian as I fully support her and the land God gave to her, and fully believe that she will one day be restored and reconciled to God as per Scripture.
Halfback wrote - "The teaching of this theology is that God has two different peoples, the Jews and the Church, with whom he deals in very different ways. Scripture does not support this teaching. Christ in John 10: 16 says "And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.""
This is a misleading paragraph. All IN Christ are one body; Jew, Gentile, Greek, Whoever, ALL are ONE IN CHRIST if they are IN CHRIST, ie, born-again. But National Israel rejected her Messiah. She is who God will deal with in the latter days. She is the Israel of the OT in which you will read prophecy after prophecy of things that will come to pass concerning her, leading to her restoration and reconciliation to her God. Now, if you want to say all Israel in the OT is the Church, you need to figure what you're going to do with those prophecies. One - apply them all to the Church, which I guarantee you they won't fit, or Two - chuck 'em all.
Romans 11: 26: "And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Zion a Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob."
This is the New Testament scripture dispensationalists use to say that Israel will be saved sometime, that is, the Israel Paul in Romans 9: 8 says "They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God."
Look at Acts 15: 13-22 where James cites Amos 9: 11-12 and says in verses 14- 15, " Simon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name. And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written. Here he quotes Amos 9: 11-12
Amos 9: 11-12 is one among several Old Testament prophecies predicting a restoration of Israel. Others are Isaiah 54: 1-5, Hosea 3: 5, and Micah 5:2.
For example Hosea 3: 5 says "Afterward shall the children of Israel return, and seek the Lord their God, and David their king; and shall fear the Lord and his goodness in the latter days."
What James says in Acts 15: 14-15 is the these prophecies agree with Peter's experience with God calling him to give the Gospel to the Gentiles, for example to Cornelius, a Gentile, in Acts 10.
In other words, even James, who was part of the Jewish group of Christians in Jerusalem, actually one of their leaders, interprets these prophecies of the restoration of Israel as including the Gentiles. These prophecies, in light of the revelation of the New Testament are not about a restoration of national Israel, those Paul says are the children of the flesh who are not the children of God in Romans 9: 8, but about a transformation of Israel from physical Israel to Israel born again in Jesus Christ.
The dispensationalists do not say that God now has one people, the Christians, but sometime in the future he will have two peoples, the "church" and the Jews. They say now God has two different peoples, the church and the Jews and he deals with them differently.
Their doctrine hinges on what Paul means by "Israel" in Romans 11: 26.. Scripture does not contradict itself. To be consistent with other scriptures including what Paul says even in Romans 11 about the unbelieving Jews being broken off, "Israel" in Rom,ans 11: 26 is all who are saved, including the saved under the Old Covenant.
The dispensationalists do not seem to pay attention to what Christ said to and about the Pharisees. They represent the unsaved larger portion of physical Israel when Christ appeared on earth.
WILL ALL ISRAEL BE SAVED BY THE END OF THE GREAT TRIBULATION??
Luke 21:24: Jesus says, �Jerusalem shall be trampled on by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are complete.� The Times of the Gentiles was from AD 70 to June 7th, 1967 when the Jews again gained complete control of Jerusalem after 1897 years. In 1948 the Jordanian Gentiles destroyed 34 of the 35 Jewish Synagogues in Jerusalem and kicked out almost all the Jews. Obama:devil: wants Israel to return to its 1948 borders.
During the Great Tribulation Moses and Elijah will most likely witness miraculously to people in the uttermost parts of the earth in all 6,000 languages. Presently the Bible has been translated into about 2,000 languages from the inspired Greek and Hebrew manuscripts and faith comes from hearing or reading the sword of the spirit which is the Word of God. The Bible still has not been translated into about 4,000 languages and Rev 5:9b and Rev 7:9,13,14 must be completely fulfilled. Surely the courageous tribulation saints will help Moses and Elijah spread God's Word. They will do a fantastic job since according to Rev 7:9,14 there will be a great multitude from EVERY TRIBE AND LANGUAGE who will be �washed in the Blood of the Lamb� during the Great Tribulation.
Rev 6:9-11: When He {Jesus} opened the 5th seal, I saw the souls of those who had been slain {Just like Jesus} because of the testimony they had maintained. They called out in a loud voice, �How long until you judge the inhabitants of the earth and avenge our blood?� The each of them was given a *WHITE ROBE*, and they were told to wait a little longer, until the number of their brothers who were to be killed as they had been was completed. Rev 7:9,13,14,15a,17a:
�After this I looked and there before me was a great multitude that no one could count, from *EVERY* NATION, TRIBE, PEOPLE AND LANGUAGE, standing before the throne and in front of the Lamb {Jesus}. They were wearing *WHITE ROBES*�Then one of the {24} elders {Rev 4:4} asked me, �These in *WHITE ROBES*�who are they and where did they come from?�� And he said, �These are they who have come out of the Great Tribulation; {Martyrs just like Jesus} they have washed their robes and made them WHITE in the *BLOOD OF THE LAMB* {Jesus}. They are before the throne of God and serve him day and night... The Lamb {Jesus} at the center of the throne will be their Shepherd.� {See Rev 12:11 & Rev 13:8-10}
This passage in Rev 7:9 above shows that the Great Tribulation will be mainly for Christians in *EVERY Gentile nation and not just Jacob�s Jewish trouble which absolutely contradicts the main thesis of the pre-trib fairy tale. Revelation 14:13: Then I heard a voice from heaven say {During the Great Trib}, "Write: Blessed are the dead who die in the Lord from now on." "Yes," says the Spirit, "they will rest from their labor, for their deeds will follow them." Rev 12:11: �They {THE TRIBULATION MARTYRS} overcame him {Satan} by the *BLOOD OF THE LAMB* and by the word of their testimony; they did not love their lives so much as to shrink from death.�
Revelation 7:3,4: The angel said, �Do not harm the land or the sea or the trees until we put a seal on the foreheads of the servants of our God,� Then I heard the number of those who were sealed: 144,000 from all the {12} tribes of Israel.
This event occurred just before the land and sea were harmed by the first 6 trumpet plagues in Rev chapters 8 & 9. Also occurring just before the first 6 trumpet plagues will be the scene in heaven above of martyrs from every nation in Rev 7:9-18. So it is completely obvious that the 144,000 Jews did NOT participate in the evangelizing of the Gentiles from every nation in the world.
There are many who believe that the 144,000 Jews will then evangelize Jews through out the world and possibly only Jews will be saved during the rest of the Great Tribulation since Gentiles from every nation of the world will already be saved. According to Zechariah 12;10; 13:8,9: Two-thirds of the Jews will be struck down and perish but one-third will call on my name and will say, �The Lord is our God.�
Presently there are approximately 15 million Jews and about 2 % or 30,000 are Christians. During the Great Tribulation 10 million Jews will die and 5 million will be saved which is and additional 4 million 970 thousand if 30 thousand are now Christians.
Romans 11:25-29: I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers, so that you may not be conceited: Israel has experienced a hardening in part **until the full number of Gentiles has come in **{As per Rev 7:9,14 above}. ***AND SO ALL ISRAEL WILL BE SAVED***, as it is written: {In Jeremiah 31:33,34} �The deliverer will come from Zion; he will turn godlessness away from Jacob {Israel}. And this is my covenant with them when I take away their sins.� As far as the gospel is concerned, they are enemies on your account; but as far as election is concerned they are loved on account of the patriarchs {Moses, Abraham, David ,Joseph, Isaiah, Elijah etc etc etc}, for God's gifts and His call are irrevocable. {Read Romans 11:11-32 and Hebrews 11:39-40}
Acts 1:6-8: The Jewish disciples asked Jesus, �Lord, are you at this time going to restore the kingdom to Israel??� Jesus said to them: �It is not for you to know the times and dates the Father has set by His own authority. But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you; and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem and to the ends of the earth.!!� Matthew 24:14: Jesus says {During the Great Tribulation} �This gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to **ALL NATIONS** and **THEN** the **END** will come!�
God also inspired 40 Jewish men to write every Word in God's Word in both the OT and NT. Jesus was 50 % Jewish and is called the King of the Jews 12 times in the NT and the 12 Apostles including Paul were all Jewish who brought the Gospel to the Gentiles in the 1st Century. The Israelites are called Jews 80 times in the OT beginning with the book of Esther about 600 BC and the Israelites are called Jews over 200 times in the NT.
Acts 2:5: �Now there were staying in Jerusalem God-fearing Jews from every nation under heaven.� And on the day of Pentecost 3,000 Jews were saved as per Acts 2:5,14,41. John 4:22b: Jesus says, "Salvation is from the Jews.!" Matthew 2:1,2: Wise men from the East asked, �Where is the One who has been born King of the Jews?� Matthew 27:11: Pilate asked Jesus, �Are you the King of the Jews?� �Yes it is as you say,� Jesus replied!
God said to Abraham, in Genesis 17:8: �The whole land of Canaan I will be give as an everlasting possession to you and your descendants after you.�
Quotes from Obama:devil: on May 20th, 2011: �Israel must learn do defend itself **BY ITSELF**!!� �Israel must return to **PRE-1967 BORDERS**!!� Nations from all over the world have heartily agreed with King Obama's 2 statements including the European Union, Russia and the United nations. Obama has also stated that he does not have to abide by the War Powers Act or the Constitution in declaring war thus making Obama a King with the power to make war against anyone he desires as long as he desires!
Ezekiel 3: 4-7 "And he said unto me, Son of man, go, get thee unto the house of Israel, and speak with my words unto them.
5. For thou art not sent to a people of a strange speech and of an hard language, but to the house of Israel;
6. Not to many people of a strange speech and of an hard language, whose words thou canst not understand. Surely, had I sent thee to them, they would have hearkened unto thee.
7. But the house of Israel will not hearken unto thee; for they will not hearken unto me: for all the house of Israel are impudent and hardhearted."
Ezekiel 2: 3-7 "And he said unto me, Son of man, I send thee to the children of Israel, to a rebellious nation that hath rebelled against me: they and their fathers have transgressed against me, even unto this very day.
4. For they are impudent children and stiffhearted. I do send thee unto them; and thou shalt say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD.
5. And they, whether they will hear, or whether they will forbear, (for they are a rebellious house,) yet shall know that there hath been a prophet among them.
6. And thou, son of man, be not afraid of them, neither be afraid of their words, though briers and thorns be with thee, and thou dost dwell among scorpions: be not afraid of their words, nor be dismayed at their looks, though they be a rebellious house.
7. And thou shalt speak my words unto them, whether they will hear, or whether they will forbear: for they are most rebellious."
II Timothy 2: 15 "Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth."
Studying to show yourself approved does not mean to study a theology, or scripture through the lens of a theology.
"This is a misleading paragraph. All IN Christ are one body; Jew, Gentile, Greek, Whoever, ALL are ONE IN CHRIST if they are IN CHRIST, ie, born-again. But National Israel rejected her Messiah. She is who God will deal with in the latter days. She is the Israel of the OT in which you will read prophecy after prophecy of things that will come to pass concerning her, leading to her restoration and reconciliation to her God. Now, if you want to say all Israel in the OT is the Church, you need to figure what you're going to do with those prophecies. One - apply them all to the Church, which I guarantee you they won't fit, or Two - chuck 'em all."
James replies:
God has only ONE group of chosen people. They either looked forward TO the Messiah, or they look back to the Messiah.
And, I see zero in Scripture about the modern day nation called Israel. There is ONE verse in the New Testament that COULD be saying that right before Christ returns that the majority of believers in Judaism would accept Jesus. If you think that just because a person happens to live in the modern nation of Israel, then you are talking about Muslims, Atheists, etc, because all kinds of godless people live in Israel today.
I am for the modern nation of Israel, they are good allies, and the only democracy in the Middle East. But, the Israel of God, are those who believe in Jesus.
Well Sir James how would you explain away the following Words of God as you explain away all the rest of Revelation.
During the Great Tribulation the following will take place: Revelation 7:3-8: The angel will say, "Do not harm the land or the sea or the trees until we put a seal on the foreheads of the servants of our God." Then I heard the number of those who were sealed. 144,000 from all the tribes of Israel. From the tribe of Judah 12,000 were sealed, from etc
So, tell me this... is the term dispensationlism or dispensationlist found in the Bible wherein a person can go and read about its meaning and how it is used in scripture?
I mean, is there anyone or any of the apostles in the New Testament who can/could be or was/were considered a dispensationlist/ dispensationlists or a believer in this ideology?
Halfback wrote - "The dispensationalists do not say that God now has one people, the Christians, but sometime in the future he will have two peoples, the "church" and the Jews. They say now God has two different peoples, the church and the Jews and he deals with them differently. Their doctrine hinges on what Paul means by "Israel" in Romans 11: 26.. Scripture does not contradict itself. To be consistent with other scriptures including what Paul says even in Romans 11 about the unbelieving Jews being broken off, "Israel" in Rom,ans 11: 26 is all who are saved, including the saved under the Old Covenant."
Actually, it is Scripture that separates national Israel from the Church, not dispensationalism. And Romans 11:26 is not the only verse that speaks of this. Take a look again at that passage-
For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: For this [is] my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
Now take a look at where Paul pulled "as it is written..."
Isaiah 59:20-21 And the Redeemer shall come to Zion, and unto them that turn from transgression in Jacob, saith the LORD.
As for me, this [is] my covenant with them, saith the LORD; My spirit that [is] upon thee, and my words which I have put in thy mouth, shall not depart out of thy mouth, nor out of the mouth of thy seed, nor out of the mouth of thy seed's seed, saith the LORD, from henceforth and for ever.
Here's some more Scripture for you.
Isaiah 43:1,8,10,25 But now thus saith the LORD that created thee, O Jacob, and he that formed thee, O Israel, Fear not: for I have redeemed thee, I have called [thee] by thy name; thou [art] mine. Bring forth the blind people that have eyes, and the deaf that have ears. Ye [are] my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I [am] he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. I, [even] I, [am] he that blotteth out thy transgressions for mine own sake, and will not remember thy sins.
Zechariah 12:10 And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for [his] only [son], and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for [his] firstborn.
Zechariah 13:1 In that day there shall be a fountain opened to the house of David and to the inhabitants of Jerusalem for sin and for uncleanness.
This has not yet come to pass. God has a covenant with Israel, the house of David, Jacob, the inhabitants of Jerusalem, all of which are referred to as Israel, not the Church, and which is separate than that of the Church. This covenant includes blotting out their transgression of disbelief. It is a promise to take away her sin and uncleanness, and a promise to never remember her sins. God loves Israel. Though she lives the harlot, God says in Hosea 2 that she will be betrothed to Him for ever, in righteousness and faithfulness.
If that is not your belief, then what do you do with those passages?
James wrote - "God has only ONE group of chosen people. They either looked forward TO the Messiah, or they look back to the Messiah."
See my reply to Halfback above. And there are several more passages dealing with this.
James wrote - "And, I see zero in Scripture about the modern day nation called Israel. There is ONE verse in the New Testament that COULD be saying that right before Christ returns that the majority of believers in Judaism would accept Jesus. If you think that just because a person happens to live in the modern nation of Israel, then you are talking about Muslims, Atheists, etc, because all kinds of godless people live in Israel today."
Zero Scripture about the "modern day nation called Israel"? What do you think... that the Israel in the OT is no longer the Israel of today? That God has cast His people, the Jews, Jacob, those of the house of David, aside, never to deal with them again? That the promises God has made to Israel and her people are null and void? And no, we're not talking about Muslims or Atheists, as they are not the apple of His eye.
James wrote - "I am for the modern nation of Israel, they are good allies, and the only democracy in the Middle East. But, the Israel of God, are those who believe in Jesus."
You and Halfback need to read the books of the OT prophets... Isaiah, Jeremiah, Hosea, Zechariah, etc, and you will see plenty written about Israel and God's future dealing with her, to include her restoration and reconciliation to Him.
"You and Halfback need to read the books of the OT prophets... Isaiah, Jeremiah, Hosea, Zechariah, etc, and you will see plenty written about Israel and God's future dealing with her, to include her restoration and reconciliation to Him."
The problem is that you do not know who Israel is.
If you do not believe the New Testament, especially Romans 9: 6-8 and Galatians 4: 24-26, that Paul is saying there are two Israels, you can't understand what these Old Testament prophecies on the restoration of Israel mean when interpreted by New Testament teachings. So, "they which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God" and "Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children" points to physical Israel which does not now exist as a people of God. Making Romans 11: 26 say that "Israel" there refers to the Jews who will all be saved does not change this - because scripture must be interpreted by scripture and to interpret Romans 11: 26 as predicting that physical Israel will all be saved goes against too much of New Testament teaching.
A few Jews will become real Christians, but the majority of Jews who come to accept some kind of Christ will not give up their identity as physical Jews under the Old Covenant.
What may in fact happen in the end times is that there can be a union between a number of theologies - dispensationalism, the Messianic Judaism movement, Hebrew Roots, Mormonism, etc - into a physical Israel first religion where much of the Old Covenant will be mixed with a belief in another Jesus. There may be more Jewish people brought into this end time movement, but they will mix he Old Covenant with their false Jesus.
