Author	Thread: SUBMIT TO HUSBAND, WRONG
GlendoraMike View Profile History	SUBMIT TO HUSBAND, WRONG Posted : 15 Jan, 2010 09:07 AM LOST IN THE TRANSLATION When we read the Bible we must remember that we are reading words that sombody or a group felt means in English what the original text meant. In another Topic, I was reading about wives submitting to their husbands. I recommend that you get a copy of the Bible in The New American Standard translation. In this translation the goal was to put forth the literial translation of the text. If the footnotes are there; you get to see the literial word if the translaters used another in the passage. The famous Ephesians 5:22-33 passage gets people wound up in knots. Many translations use the word "submitt" as in this example from the NIV: EPH 5:22 Wives, submit to your husbands as to the Lord. 23 For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body, of which he is the Savior. 24 Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit to their husbands in everything. However, the word in the original is better translated as "be subject." This means, "to place or rank under." Here's were it really gets interesting. If you have an NAS Bible like mine you will find that there are words in ITALICS. This means that the word that we are reading wasn't in the original text, but it is put there to help the reading go smoother by adding meaning. In Eph. 5:22, we would read: Wives to your own husbands, as to the Lord." The use of the words "be subject" comes from verse 21, which says, "and be subject to one another in the fear of Christ." This verse has a footnote that shows that "fear" can also mean reverence. Let me end with: EPH 5:25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her 26 to make her holy, cleansing her by the washing with water through the word, 27 and to present her to himself as a radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or any other blemish, but holy and blameless. 28 In this same way, husbands ought to love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. 29 After all, no one ever hated his own body, but he feeds and cares for it, just as Christ does the church-- 30 for we are members of his body. 31 "For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh." 32 This is a profound mystery--but I am talking about Christ and the church. 33 However, each one of you also must love his wife as he loves himself, and the wife must respect her husband. LOVE IN CHRIST TO ALL OF YOU:waving::angel: Post Reply
View Profile History	SUBMIT TO HUSBAND, WRONG Posted : 15 Jan, 2010 09:32 AM hi, i don't seem to be getting your point. what is the difference between submission and being subject to/to rank under? Nyanda Post Reply
GraceMae View Profile History	SUBMIT TO HUSBAND, WRONG Posted : 15 Jan, 2010 09:35 AM Thanks for the post Mike. This passage is interpreted so many different ways as we've heard in the world and on this site. Yes, different translations and notes and history about the world back then help us undertand what is meant, and what I don't understand I try to seek spiritual guidance from spiritual leaders and my pastor. There is only one "truth" though. Continue to be a blesssing. ~ GraceMae Post Reply
GlendoraMike View Profile History	SUBMIT TO HUSBAND, WRONG Posted : 15 Jan, 2010 01:38 PM In our culture, we see the word submit as meaning something that a slave would do. Be subject to is more in line with us obeying the laws of this country. In a marriage it would be the buck stops here at the husband. He is to lead. Leading is something done from the front not from the back like herding. Post Reply
View Profile History	SUBMIT TO HUSBAND, WRONG Posted : 15 Jan, 2010 03:16 PM language wise, i would think it is the other way around. to be subject too is stronger than to submit to. submission is to defer leadership and power. subjugation is closer to slavery or like a king ruling his subjects. This difference is greater when you are subject too. i can research the Word a bit more but both may apply in marriage. i look into it... Post Reply
DontHitThatMark View Profile History	SUBMIT TO HUSBAND, WRONG Posted : 15 Jan, 2010 06:03 PM Not seeing the point either. Are you saying that this text in the bible is actually not supposed to be there? :peace::peace: Post Reply
GlendoraMike View Profile History	SUBMIT TO HUSBAND, WRONG Posted : 16 Jan, 2010 08:56 AM The use of the word submit in our society is taken to mean that the wife should be ruled by what ever the husband says. That useage is what causes the problem. To be subject to is like our laws. I own my property, but the law says that I can't have a target shooting event on my property. I go along with the law leading me in this regard. Nobody comes out and locks me up ahead of time so that I couldn't do this even though I don't want to. The passage is based on Paul's giving us advice on how we should live. Verse 21 says that we should be subject to one another in reverence of Christ. The femmenists attacked Christianity based on just reading the "submit" word. Post Reply
View Profile History	SUBMIT TO HUSBAND, WRONG Posted : 16 Jan, 2010 12:20 PM the word "submit" in the greek means to be under obedience. Jennifer Post Reply
shepherdingking View Profile History	SUBMIT TO HUSBAND, WRONG Posted : 16 Jan, 2010 12:47 PM Taken out of context, "Husbands Love your wives," becomes a mantra for failure in the husbands who may not be as strong as Christ or to lay down their life. This is not just for husbands to lay down lives, though our culture has rightly romanticized the hero who saves women and children by sacrificing himself first. It says we should all love one another as Christ who gave Himself. That could be just as easily mean wives love your husbands (or children) as Christ loved the church and gave Himself for it. The beginning of Ephesians five starts out with an example of this love. "1 Therefore be imitators of God, as beloved children; 2 and walk in love, just as Christ also loved you and gave Himself up for us, an offering and a sacrifice to God as a fragrant aroma. Ephesians5:1-2. Unlike an offering for sin the "an offering and a sacrifice to God as a fragrant aroma" is a love offering. In other words you are not saved by giving up yourself, but it is still very pleasing to God. :bouncy: But IF you WERE saved by giving of yourself it should be remembered what Jesus said to those that gave as unto the Lord. "The King will answer and say to them, 'Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did it to one of these brothers of Mine, even the least of them, you did it to Me.' "Then He will also say to those on His left, 'Depart from Me, accursed ones, into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the devil and his angels;" Matt 25:40-41. Post Reply
DontHitThatMark View Profile History	SUBMIT TO HUSBAND, WRONG Posted : 16 Jan, 2010 03:58 PM Yeah but...it's in the context of a man that loves his wife like Christ loves the church. Just like we submit to Christ, and woman is supposed to submit to a GODLY man. There is a structure to the church, and to family's that is supposed to help us walk in the right path. It's not that a man is better than a woman...it's simply that we have different roles to play. Pretty sure the bible is clear on these roles, and this verse you're referring to is not the only place it talks about this. So use the bible to interpret the bible. Many places it says the man was placed in authority. Conditional! A GOOD MAN! :peace::peace: Post Reply
ladythumper View Profile History	SUBMIT TO HUSBAND, WRONG Posted : 16 Jan, 2010 05:21 PM Mike! Love it. Congratulations! Ur the first man on here who's biblical and not one sided when it comes to how both parties are to act in a marriage. You agreed that the man is suppose to love his wife as Christ loved the church and u didn't try to weasel out of it. First time seen a man do this. They like to harp on like a broken record how a woman is suppose to submit to a man. Several men have placed posts demanding that women are to be submissive to them but have failed to state that they are commanded to love their wives like how Jesus loves the church. If you men want the leadership role so much then start leading by loving your wife like the way the bible commands and then she would be eager to submit to you and not before. Gbu Kimberly:-) ps. seems like men try to hide the fact that the bible states they are to love their wives and not provoke them so that they can keep the upper hand. The cat is out of the bag now. I personally won't submit to a man who doesn't love me like Christ loves the church. Post Reply

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