I don't date men who are divorced merely because why should I have to deal with all their baggage of ex-wives when I don't have ex-husbands for you to deal with. I call this out on being what's fair to me.
Sure will get much hate mail on this since ur all divorced from what I can see.
If ur in a bad marriage then get out. People in church try to make you think that divorce is worse than any other sin they act like it's worse than murder and stealing. Divorce is a sin like any other sin and you can be forgiven for such sins. If people really practiced what they preached on board here then they wouldn't be looking for a wife on board here when they are divorced and their ex is still alive. Except for it be in the case where the ex wife is deceased or cheated on you then the bible states u are to remain unmarried. Ur sinning against the bible when ur searching for a wife.
It's wrong to support scripture when it supports ur case and deny scripture when it doesnt support ur case.
I believe that if a man or woman is in any kind of abusive marriage then they need to get out of that marriage pronto. God will forgive them just like he forgave the woman who had 5 husbands. God hates divorce but he never states anywhere in the bible that it's the unforgiveable sin like many of you seem to believe. All sin is sin and can be forgiven if u truly repent.
God never intended for women to be dominated in marriage and have no say. God wants us ladies to be treated like treasures where we submit to our husbands and our husbands submit to us. Where we treat our husbands like gold.
God is a good, just and fair God. He understands if ur going thru hell in ur marriage and will forgive you if u divorce. I love it how people on here are one sided and only support scripture that benefit them. The men just as much as the women have been commanded to be submissive. It's a 2 way street not a one way.
One of you keep making ludicrous remarks to support ur one sided view. Bethsheeba and the women who were married to David were married to a King no other than King David himself. Back in that time u didn't say no to a King if you wanted to live. I'm curious to know if she could've refused him when he wanted to committ adultery with him? Who says no to a King? I do know that she couldn't divorce him and leave or any of his other wives for that matter and expect to live.
We need to get out of an unhealthy marriage where, emotional, physical abuse is taking place. If he's into porn or cheating on you doping it up... drugs and alcohol then get out. He is commanded to love you like Christ loved the church if he's not then get out. God will forgive u divorce isn't the unforgiveable sin.
I don't condone petty reasons for divorce like he got fat on you or has bad habits like drinks from the milk jug and so forth.
You divorce for unbiblical reasons that's sin number one, you repent ask God to forgive you he does. This time you pick a Godly woman and marry again. However you remarried when ex wife still alive that's sin number 2. God will forgive both of these sins this isn't the unforgiveable sin.
Christian men and non Christian men can both be neanderthols don't give me that bull. We all know better than that. I'm just the only one on here brave enough to say it.
Christian married men (Im talking bout preachers too who have fallen to sin) are cheating on their wives, into porn and beating on their wives....not to mention their drinking behavior. I could care less if anyone on here calls urself a Christian if ur doing any of these things to God's daughters then that makes you a neanderthol.
Christan wives likewise who do the same above behaviors to their husbands then they are barbaric cave women. God will deal with these hypocrites.
I had to smile at your comment that you don't date divorced men.
Years ago I knew a single man who had never been married. He made no bones about the fact (we were in a large Christian singles group at the time) that he was looking for a virgin and someone who had not been married before.
This man eventually found himself into his late 30's and still unmarried. Then, he met and married a divorced woman with a small child. They were very happy together
I tell you this not to argue against your stand. (Who am I to do that?) I tell you this not to say "this will happen to you!" (how should I know?)
I tell you this because, in my own experience in my life, I have said to God "I want this...." or, "I am planning for that...." and what has happened is God has smiled at me and said, "This is what I have for you...." And it turns out to be something totally diferent than what I had planned or wanted.
God is good. God loves me more than I can fully comprehend. And I know that I know that I know He wants only the best for me. So even though my life has turned out very, VERY different than I ever thought it would..... God is good. All the time. And all the time, God is good.
The Bible says Drunkards have no part of the Kingdom of God. And for good reason. But divorce is banned only in a case (Old Testament) where a man takes an unmarried or non betrothed maiden. If He is approved by the father, He must pay the father the Bride price for virgins and marry her. He must not divorce her all his days. Notice they are not taken out and stoned like those committing fornication i.e. Adultery, Homosexuals, incest, prostitution or bestiality.
Now as for your non biblical grounds for divorce if I had a wife and she got drunk once I would not divorce her. But if she did it again I would likely throw her out.
You have your standards and I have mine. :rocknroll:
You have said some things regarding divorce and marriage that simply is not in compliance with God word. While this issue is no doubt a sensitive one and can bring about much emotion, i believe we have to approach this with a willingness to comform to God's Will and not our own desires or beliefs.
God made it very clear that regarding divorce among believers there is one allowable reason for divorce and that is "Fornication" and Fornication only! Not any other reason among BELIEVERS. I stress believers because there is one other allowance and that is if a NON-Believer leaves a Believer then you are allowed to get divorced and remarried. But let's examine some things.
First while as you pointed out that Divorce is not the "unpardonable sin" and I agree with you, we also have to realize that while God does forgive a REPENTANT sinner, He still does NOT allow for remarriage of the Divorce person unless it was biblical. If a woman leaves her husband because he was VERBALLY or MENTALLY or even PHYSICALLY abusive then she cannot remarry. THAT is not grounds for a divorce. She can remain apart from him to stay safe but she must remain reconciled to him unless he DIES ...OR.... during the course of separation he commits Fornication, then that will release her. Peter actually addressed the issue of abuse in a marriage and you know what? You are not going to like what he had to say. This is tough but it is God's Word for Christians. I apologize for it's length but it is worth the study.
Hi Everyone,
This topic concerning abuse of a spouse can be very emotional for a few. I would hope that all of us here are interested only in the truth of God�s word no matter what it says and means. I have seen many people on this thread give many opinions without scriptural support which were obviously emotionally based and others who gave their opinions and used scripture to support their belief. I am going to present you with scripture we have all seen before but many have failed to see the serious implications and applications of a particular passage that does deal with the issue of abuse and the woman's obligation in that scenario. This is going to be most probably the toughest pill to swallow. I am presenting to you what I believe the word teaches. I do pray that before you respond that you pray about this first and please understand my heart in this is truly sympathetic. I have witnessed abuse between my parents and as a Former Police Officer I investigated many such crimes. My heart truly goes out to those of you who have been abused and I find abuse to be disgusting and it does anger me. I do not believe that God condones abuse anymore than He condones any other sin either so please be careful when studying this post that you do not forget God's heart in this!
Recently I posted a rebuttal to an article that was grossly in error concerning the woman's role in the marriage regarding submission and addressed the grammar of specific words. What most of you missed was what Peter said and how a wife was to relate to another situation. If you respond to my post here without reading it in it's entirety you will miss the mark. Please take your time and let this matter sink in. I would normally apologize for it's length but It's importance necessitates more scriptures to be brought into this study.
Let's start out with the passage about what Jesus commanded as a NEW Testament teaching for Christians. No one can say this is legalistic nor can they say this is something exclusively under the law. The Sermon on the Mount contained in Matt 5, 6 & 7 is the beginning of Jesus' teaching to us as Christians. Here is where He began to give us New Commandments and many times contrasted these New Commandments to the Mosaic Law. What is important about this Sermon is that this falls under the Great Commission commandment that He gave in that we are to teach all things whatsoever He taught His Disciples directly and privately. See Mat 28:19-20. So no one can say this is legalism.
Mat 5:31 "Furthermore it has been said, 'Whoever divorces his wife, let him give her a certificate of divorce.'
Mat 5:32 But I say to you that whoever divorces his wife for any reason except sexual immorality causes her to commit adultery; and whoever marries a woman who is divorced commits adultery. NKJV
So we see above that Christ Jesus gave only one exception for divorce and remarriage and that is "sexual Immorality". Different versions use Fornication and Adultery. They all mean the same thing. Now we know that Jesus is God the Son and knowing His Father's will and knowing all things, don't you think that if He thought that if abuse of a spouse was allowed as a reason for divorce then He, in His infinite wisdom would have stated so? Or do you think God just forgot and said to Himself latter...whoops...I forgot that one...I guess they will figure it out for themselves".
In Matt 19 we have more discussion in this matter.
Mat 19:3 The Pharisees also came to Him, testing Him, and saying to Him, "Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for just any reason?"
4 And He answered and said to them, "Have you not read that He who made them at the beginning 'MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE,'
5 and said, 'FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER AND BE JOINED TO HIS WIFE, AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH' ?
6 So then, they are no longer two but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let not man separate."
7 They said to Him, "Why then did Moses command to give a certificate of divorce, and to put her away?"
8 He said to them, "Moses, because of the hardness of your hearts, permitted you to divorce your wives, but from the beginning it was not so.
9 And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another, commits adultery; and whoever marries her who is divorced commits adultery."
Notice again we have the same only exception for divorce....Sexual Immorality/Fornication/Adultery. Now notice the observation His Disciples made about the Marriage Covenant.
10 His disciples said to Him, "If such is the case of the man with his wife, it is better not to marry."
They recognized the strictness of how GOD and Jesus looks at the Marriage Covenant and that there is only one allowance for Divorce and remarriage...between BELIEVERS.
11 But He said to them, "All cannot accept this saying, but only those to whom it has been given: NKJV
Well my brothers and sisters, this has been given to us. The question is are you going to obey God and Jesus?
Let�s now go to a passage where Peter was dealing with the topic of submission but with the wives being married to unbelievers. I want to take you to chapter 2 first because it is directly related and gives the meaning of what is being conveyed a greater force of weight in the evidence.
1Peter 2:18 Servants, be submissive to your masters with all fear, not only to the good and gentle, but also to the harsh.
In other words servants are to submit themselves not only to the gentile and good Masters but also to those Masters who treat them harshly. You might want to meditate on that a moment.
Here we see the same Greek word about subjecting ones� self, in this case a servant to his/her master.
19 For this is commendable, if because of conscience toward God one endures grief, suffering wrongfully.
20 For what credit is it if, when you are beaten for your faults, you take it patiently? But when you do good and suffer, if you take it patiently, this is commendable before God.
21 For to this you were called, because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that you should follow His steps:
This is a very hard statement I know but it is the inspired word of God. Some of you might say Walter so what this is about servants. Let's continue.
22 "WHO COMMITTED NO SIN, NOR WAS DECEIT FOUND IN HIS MOUTH";
23 who, when He was reviled, did not revile in return; when He suffered, He did not threaten, but committed Himself to Him who judges righteously;
24 who Himself bore our sins in His own body on the tree, that we, having died to sins, might live for righteousness�by whose stripes you were healed.
25 For you were like sheep going astray, but have now returned to the Shepherd and Overseer of your souls.
Now look what Peter says next about how wives are to be towards their �non believing� husbands.
1Pe 3:1 Wives, likewise, be submissive to your own husbands, that even if some do not obey the word, they, without a word, may be won by the conduct of their wives,
It is extremely important to notice the word Peter applies to women in verse one above. �LIKEWISE�. This means Peter is telling the wives to subject themselves in the very same manner as the servants are to subject themselves to their Masters in the previous verses. There is no wiggle room here. No way to escape the meaning no matter how much grammatical twisting is applied.
from 3664; ; adv AV-likewise 28, moreover + 1161 1, so 1; 30
likewise, equally, in the same way
2 when they observe your chaste conduct accompanied by fear.
3 Do not let your adornment be merely outward�arranging the hair, wearing gold, or putting on fine apparel�
4 rather let it be the hidden person of the heart, with the incorruptible beauty of a gentle and quiet spirit, which is very precious in the sight of God.
5 For in this manner, in former times, the holy women who trusted in God also adorned themselves, being submissive to their own husbands,
6 as Sarah obeyed Abraham, calling him lord, whose daughters you are if you do good and are not afraid with any terror.
So here we see that even Sarah called Abraham �Lord�. What does �Lord � mean.
G2962 κύριος kurios pronounced koo'-ree-os
From κῦρος kuros (supremacy); supreme in authority, that is, (as noun) controller; by implication Mr. (as a respectful title): - God, Lord, master, Sir.
I don�t think any commentary is needed here. It is very clear.
7 Husbands, likewise, dwell with them with understanding, giving honor to the wife, as to the weaker vessel, and as being heirs together of the grace of life, that your prayers may not be hindered.
8 Finally, all of you be of one mind, having compassion for one another; love as brothers, be tenderhearted, be courteous;
9 not returning evil for evil or reviling for reviling, but on the contrary blessing, knowing that you were called to this, that you may inherit a blessing.
Now after reading Peter we can see that Paul, in the below passage does not contradict Peter and that both Apostles addressed the issue in perfect harmony.
Eph 5:22 Wives, submit to your own husbands, as to the Lord.
23 For the husband is head of the wife, as also Christ is head of the church; and He is the Savior of the body.
24 Therefore, just as the church is subject to Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in everything.
25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself for her,
26 that He might sanctify and cleanse her with the washing of water by the word,
27 that He might present her to Himself a glorious church, not having spot or wrinkle or any such thing, but that she should be holy and without blemish.
28 So husbands ought to love their own wives as their own bodies; he who loves his wife loves himself.
29 For no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as the Lord does the church.
30 For we are members of His body, of His flesh and of His bones. NKJV
Now let me say some things here regarding all of this. While it is painfully clear how God wants Christian women to behave towards their husbands no matter if they themselves are Christian or Pagan, if you are being physically or sexually abused, for safety sakes do remove yourself from the sphere of danger. While you are separated, do whatever you can to help your spouse get some professional help and some spiritual guidance and yourself to if need be. You must allow GOD the time to work out whatever HE has to. God can and does perform miracles. A few of you quoted statistics but failed to give your sources for them. Do those bleak statistics only involve Christian marriages? I don't think so. If they are not exclusive to Christians then they are skewed. Irregardless, God does work miracles and you must allow for that and it may take some time. Here is something you should consider. While you are separated it is a likelihood that your spouse will commit adultery and if that does occur then you can be free from the covenant...HOWEVER... adultery, though an allowance for divorce and remarriage does not mean that God wants you to divorce. God expects us to work on the marriage and get healed and hopefully reconcile "IF" possible. We have to see things through the eyes of Christ.
Remember that if your spouse does not commit adultery you are still bound to them and cannot remarry as adultery between two believers is the only allowance for remarriage other than death.
The question is this. Are the women of God willing to be obedient to God�s clear written Word or will they choose to be in disobedience. God cannot contradict His written word. Satan however always tries to pervert it!
If someone says well divorce is not the unpardonable sin implying that you should go ahead and get remarried irregardless of what God says, that demonstrates an evil disobedient heart and that person has a serious spirit problem.
If someone says well divorce is not the unpardonable sin implying that you should go ahead and get remarried irregardless of what God says, that demonstrates an evil disobedient heart and that person has a serious spirit problem.
mine here
i believe thats a matter of intrepretation..
im with you on reasons allowed for divorce biblically.. although you can have one when an unbelieving spouse leaves as a biblical reason also..
but your words above i cant quite agree with..
i look at it as what if a believer goes out and committs murder and hes now in prison and you go see him as spiritual council.. and he believes that he can never be forgiven by GOD for such a hanieous crime..
and if i did council him i would say to him , what you done is wrong.. but if you feel soorow ,remorse then seek forgiveness ask for it and you will be forgiven of said sin.
now i may not say to him , cause thats not the one unpardonable sin..
but you can bet i thought it and had to believe it or i couldnt of given that council..
cause sayin that out loud aint the worst thing one can do. cause if you believe it in your heart that theres only one unforgivable sin as i do.. and it is biblical.. the bible tells us so , so i believe it..
thats not to say we should continue in sin so grace may abound.. no surely not..
thats to say that GOD is GOD of mercy and grace..
and i pray HE shows me lots of mercy.. as im gonna need it.. cause i surely aint been perfect ..
so like i said your statement above is really just a matter of interpretation.. you intrepreted it one way and i another..
you are right though as sometimes people with use its not the unforgivable sin as a way to tempt others.. but i didnt feel that here..
Divorce isn't the unforgiveable sin regardless of how much u try to misinterpret scripture in ur favor to make it appear so.
Ladies if ur in an abusive marriage get out and live.......God understands what ur going thru and he will forgive this sin just like he has all ur other sins. All sins are equal in God's eyes he will forgive this sin just as quick as he'd forgive ur sin of letting a curse word come out of ur mouth.
I've already made a promise that when I marry Im not staying married to
a man who's mentally, physically abuses me or my baby and if he is into porn, cheats, hangs out with lady friends over me, does drugs and drinks to get drunk and if he insults me in public I will tell him to pack his bag and leave. He's not loving me like himself and he's not loving me like Christ loved the Church so he has to leave. Now honestly after being married to someone like that I'm sure Id never want to marry again.
So as far as marrying again I'm not in that postion so will let you guys settle that one amongst urselves.
Thats not true anything that you say against the Holy spirit sayin that his works are the deviel that is sin.....until death you have a chance to accept after that your are done !!!
My quote: "If someone says well divorce is not the unpardonable sin implying that you should go ahead and get remarried irregardless of what God says, that demonstrates an evil disobedient heart and that person has a serious spirit problem."
I think you may me misinterpreting what I am saying. I am not saying that their sin is unforgivable, as it is. What I am saying is that when a person has THAT attitude, it shows they have a spirit problem. Their heart is not right with God. That is abusing Grace. That is abusing their liberty in Christ.
