Here is a study on a very important issue, especially for those of us who are single/divorced/widowed and are looking for that right mate.
1Cor 6::9 � Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites,
10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God.
Now Paul contrasts believers from unbelievers
11 And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.
12 All things are lawful for me, but all things are not helpful. All things are lawful for me, but I will not be brought under the power of any.
13 Foods for the stomach and the stomach for foods, but God will destroy both it and them. Now the body is not for sexual immorality but for the Lord, and the Lord for the body.
14 And God both raised up the Lord and will also raise us up by His power.
15 Do you not know that your bodies are members of Christ? Shall I then take the members of Christ and make them members of a harlot? Certainly not!
Let me pause here for a moment and go over what the term "Harlot" means. It is anyone who engages in sex outside of marriage either for money.... OR... PLEASURE.
16 Or do you not know that he who is joined to a harlot is one body with her? For "the two," He says, "shall become one flesh." {Gen 2:24}
17 But he who is joined to the Lord is one spirit with Him.
18 FLEE sexual immorality. Every sin that a man does is outside the body, but he who commits sexual immorality sins against his own body.
19 Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and you are not your own?
20 For you were bought at a price; therefore glorify God in your body and in your spirit, which are God�s.
Your body belongs to Christ and it no longer belongs to you, if indeed you are a Christian.
1Cor 5:11 But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortioner��not even to eat with such a person.
Above, Paul is making a very strong statement to not have any fellowship with someone claiming to be a believer and yet are in a state of UNREPENTANT fornication.
Let's take a closer look at what fornication is and what it means to "TOUCH" a woman.
1Cor 7:1 And concerning the things of which ye wrote to me: good it is for a man NOT to touch a woman, (YLT)
2 and because of the whoredom let each man have his own wife, and let each woman have her proper husband; (YLT)
1Cor 7:2 Nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let
every man have his own wife, and let every woman have
her own husband.(KJV)
Fornication:
4202 porneia porneia por-ni�-ah
from 4203; TDNT-6:579,918; n f
AV-fornication 26; 26
1) illicit sexual intercourse
1a) adultery, fornication, homosexuality, lesbianism, intercourse with animals etc.
1b) sexual intercourse with close relatives; #Le 18:6-23
1c) sexual intercourse with a divorced man or woman; #Mr 10:11,12
2) metaph. the worship of idols
2a) of the defilement of idolatry, as incurred by eating the sacrifices offered to idols
4203 proneuw porneuo porn-yoo�-o
from 4204; TDNT-6:579,918; v
AV-commit fornication 7, commit 1; 8
1) to prostitute one�s body to the lust of another
2) to give one�s self to unlawful sexual intercourse
2a) to commit fornication
3) metaph. to be given to idolatry, to worship idols
3a) to permit one�s self to be drawn away by another into idolatry
Now Paul is not saying that you should go ahead and get married just to have sex so don't book any reservations and run off to Las Vegas. OK? Marriage must be built on deeper things and it is a life long commitment. Sex is the icing on the cake so to speak.
llet's address the word "TOUCH" in it's context of this passage.
G680 haptomai hap'-tom-ahee
Reflexive of G681; properly to attach oneself to, that is, to touch (in many implied relations): - touch.(Strongs)
Thayer Definition:
1) to fasten one�s self to, adhere to, cling to
1a) to touch 1b) of carnal intercourse with a women or cohabitation
1c) of levitical practice of having no fellowship with heathen practices. Things not to be touched appear to be both women and certain kinds of food, so celibacy and abstinence of certain kinds of food and drink are recommended.
1d) to touch, assail anyone
Part of Speech: verb
The proper application of this word in this context is 1B) "of carnal intercourse with a women or cohabitation." Obviously from this verse Paul is not intending for us to interpret it as any form of prostitution, but as "pre-marital" sexual relations, which of course could include a prostitute but the passage is not exclusive to it. So as he continues in verse 2, when he says "Fornication" or as Young's puts it, "Whoredom", it is not to be construed as anything other than Pre-marital sex. That would of course imply extra-marital sex.
Webster's definition.
WHOREDOM, n. Horedom.
1. Lewdness; fornication; practice of unlawful commerce with the other sex. It is applied to either sex, and to any kind of illicit commerce.2. In Scripture, idolatry; the desertion of the worship of the true God, for the worship of idols.
So even in Webster's the term Whoredom and fornication mean the same thing.
So to avoid "Fornication" you have to be married otherwise when you have sexual relations with someone you are not married to, then it is "Fornication" / "whoredom" and it is a SIN. And let me touch on an issue I did a study on. If you meet someone and they are "separated" in the process of a divorce, this means that they are still married in the eyes of God. You are not single and you are not free to date and especially not free to have sex. God allows for man's laws and until a judge finalizes the divorce decree, then you are still married and it does not matter the circumstances. Adultery does not automatically cause the marriage covenant to be broken though it is grounds for a divorce to be sought if necessary. If your spouse commited adultery and you are seeking a divorce and then you also while separated have sexual relations with someone, then you have commited adultery as well. You are in a serious predicament now because you may have nullified your right to divorce in God's eyes. How are you any less guilty?
If Pre-Marital or extra-marital sex were permitted there would be no reason for Paul to say that it is better for a man NOT to TOUCH a woman and to avoid "fornication" let each man have his own wife (singular) and each woman have her own husband, (singular).
Now I know some of you are saying, man have I messed up. Well the wonderful thing about Jesus is that His blood covers your sins providing you have placed your Faith in Him and have been baptized. But the key for forgiveness is "Repentance". Have you repented? It means that you have had a 180 degree complete turn around in your mind and do not plan on repeating it. Sometimes it takes time to get past our sins. Sometimes we are under bondage. But God's grace will give you the strength to break free. After all, Christ came to free us from our sins and it's bondage. You know the devils know your weaknesses and will exploit them and our sexual desires are one of the strongest physical desires that God gave us. So the key is to not place yourself in a place where your integrity will be compromised. In other words don't be alone with someone of the opposite sex if you know in your heart of hearts that there is any possibility of stumbling or causing them to stumble. Remember that God loves you and wants the best for you!
Hi Walter, I also had mail missing from my box. What's going on here? Are we as mature grown people being sensored even in our message mail box? WOW!... Doesn't make sense to me... I've written the administrator, so hopefully we'lll get some answers...
I have to disagree with you on your interpretation and application or lack of. There is no question as to Paul's intent of the word usage of Fornication as to include Pre-Marital Sex. It did make the list which you claim did not. If Paul did not intended Pre-Marital Sex to be forbidden or included within the scope of "Fornication" then you have a problem with the passage below which I also addressed in my original post.
1Cor 7:1 Now concerning the things of which you wrote to me: It is good for a man not to touch a woman.
2 Nevertheless, because of sexual immorality,[fornication] let each man have his own wife, and let each woman have her own husband. NKJV
If Paul did not intend Pre-Marital sex to be included withing the scope of "Fornication" then there would be no need for him to say that to avoid fornication, then we need to get married. If being "in love" was all that is necessary why bother getting married? You simply cannot justify having sex with someone that is not your spouse no matter which way you try to twist the meaning of the word.
First let's address the word "TOUCH" in it's context of this passage.
G680 haptomai hap'-tom-ahee
Reflexive of G681; properly to attach oneself to, that is, to touch (in many implied relations): - touch.(Strongs)
Thayer Definition:
1) to fasten one�s self to, adhere to, cling to
1a) to touch 1b) of carnal intercourse with a women or cohabitation
1c) of levitical practice of having no fellowship with heathen practices. Things not to be touched appear to be both women and certain kinds of food, so celibacy and abstinence of certain kinds of food and drink are recommended.
1d) to touch, assail anyone
Part of Speech: verb
The proper application of this word in this context is 1B) "of carnal intercourse with a women or cohabitation." Obviously from this verse Paul is not intending for us to interpret it as merely any form of prostitution, but as "pre-marital" sexual relations, which of course could include a prostitute but the passage is not exclusive to it. To further drive home the point. Look at Paul's comments to the UNMARRIED and keep in mind this is still the same context since it is still part of the same discourse he was giving above.
1Cor 7:8 But I say to the unmarried and to the widows: It is good for them if they remain even as I am;
9 but if they cannot exercise self-control, let them marry. For it is better to marry than to burn with passion. NKJV
Bottom line. If you are unmarried and cannot control your sexual desires then get married or else be as Paul and remain single and not have any sex.
Pre-Marital sex is a sin in God's eyes and no amount of twisting God's word can change that.
I have to disagree with you on your interpretation and application �
If being "in love" was all that is necessary why bother getting married? �no matter which way you try to twist the meaning of the word."
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I had thought being in Love was a big part of marriage. I could be wrong. There are so many marriages today which end without enough Love to survive.
1 Corinthians 7:2 says �because of fornications, let each man have his own wife, and let each woman have her own husband.�
It does not say get married because you might commit pre marital sex. Premarital sex was not even an issue in those days as it is today. Corinth was not known for quick weddings because young couples could not wait. Corinth was known for fornications. Pre-marital sex has to do, in an indirect way, with marital sex.
You ask a good question, �why bother getting married?� I would ask what is a marriage? Unless you can give a reasonable definition of marriage then how do you even know what it is you are talking about?
I posted this yesterday, but it disappeared, so I will try again.
I agree that sex for pleasure within the marriage relationship is never a sin. That was God's intent, that we enjoy it enough to populate the earth. And marriage is the context for that enjoyment.
We are all aware of the Jewish tradition of verifying the virginity of the bride on the wedding night, and stoning her to death if she was not a virgin. Do you think God would have allowed that to be written in the law, if He was for premarital sex? It made no difference if it was her future husband that took her virginity, she was stoned anyway. This is one of the reasons the story of Mary is so powerful, she literally put her life in god's hands by allowing God to impregnate her.
Just so that I am clear on this. With just a yes or no answer please are you saying that sex outside of marriage is okay for a Christian.
No need for explanations or scripture. I am just trying to get clarity on your views.�
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No need for scripture? Wait a minute, just to be clear here. Many people have many opinions, mine is that marriage is honorable. And sex should be too.
You have still not demonstrated with any sound exegesis of scripture that your position is correct, if indeed you believe that Pre-Marital sex is not a sin and AOK with God.
If indeed you are advocating that having sex before Marriage is not a sin then you are teaching a False Doctrine and a dangerous one. The arguments you use are nothing new and typical of those who would "prey" upon women who were not well grounded upon God's Word. (2Tim3)
You also have not demonstrated where my exegesis is in error. Please demonstrate where I violated Hermeneutic principles.
Have you ever had Pre-Marital sex? Did you have any conviction from the Holy Spirit that it was wrong?
I have been there and done that like many of us have and I tell you that the Holy Spirit of God who indwells me sure convicted me that it was wrong and we were committed to each other and deeply in love. She was also convicted.
1Cor 7:7 For I wish that all men were even as I myself. But each one has his own gift from God, one in this manner and another in that.
8 But I say to the UNMARRIED and to the widows: It is good for them if they remain even as I am;
9 but if they cannot exercise SELF CONTROL, LET THEM MARRY. For it is better to marry than to burn with passion. NKJV [caps mine for emphasis.]
Again the scriptures refute your position. What would be Paul's point if this was not dealing with "Pre-Marital Sex". What do you think Paul meant by "self control" if not pre-marital sex?
Remember that Jewish customs do not apply here because Paul is addressing Gentile Christians who were never under the Law.
Thank you for that very clear, doctrinally sound post. And yes there are Christian men who do prey on women who are not well grounded in the word. I do know that any Spirit filled Christian woman who is well grounded in the word would never wish to date or marry men who teach false doctrine and cause weaker brethren to stumble.
I'm maybe the one to have to offer and apology for the missing text. Much like the Gnostic scriptures, perhaps issues that cause controversy were felt better cast aside rather than allowing for discussion. I thank the administrators for not rebuking my posting privileges. Unfortunately, all your opinions were lost too.
So, we are in agreement, "recreational encounters" are a no-no. We can break off our wedding plans because the one we were promise to was physically intimate with us, right? That and being labeled a "harlot" is the fear we should instill in the youth to keep them chaste? Sounds like maybe we've been romantizing the story of the birds and the bees a little too much, forgetting to check underneath the matresses in our son's room, and turn some filters on their computers.
I believe if there is anyone to blames when it comes to this topic it would not be the ones who ask the questions, but the ones who give the answers. In my previous post, I believe that the questions I posed were valid for anyone to ask their elders. In the deleted post I presented an argument, which was debatable, but when it comes to the Body of Christ we should all be in agreement.
Let me present this and I hope it doesn't get deleted, it is much like the young virgin's story.
I had met someone off of a secular dating site a little over a year ago. Not a ravaging beauty but someone that would have been nice to grow old with. To make a long story short, after two weeks of seeing eachother we shared dinner at her place and let things go a litlle too far. You guessed it, it didn't feel right to me so I couldn't perform. I can still remeber her words, "I don't think this is going to work, the one thing that I Didn't like about my last marriage was my husband who used satisfy me didn't anymore. You're a great guy, but really I have needs and I don't want to wait." Her husband divorced her for a younger woman. Honestly, it was a blessing, I'm glad I found that out before getting too serious with her. What if we took the marital plunge and I couldn't satisfy her? She had already been through that and what would our union be like with her being unhappy?
So a lesson here. Wait till your married before enjoying eachother. Build the spiritual bond between the two of you for that is what keeps you together through thick and thin. If one of you cannot wait, then the carnality will only affect your union. It is better not to base your marriage on the flesh because if that satisfaction stops one may go elsewhere. Men should show strength when dealing with the flesh, women should so restraint in that it doesn't cause either of you to sin. The young need to remember that the possible consquences for indulging in carnal desires can be disastrous and lead one into a life of despair and loneliness.
You have still not demonstrated with any sound exegesis of scripture that your position is correct, if indeed you believe that Pre-Marital sex is not a sin and AOK with God.
If indeed you are advocating that having sex before Marriage is not a sin then you are teaching a False Doctrine and a dangerous one. The arguments you use are nothing new and typical of those who would "prey" upon women who were not well grounded upon God's Word. (2Tim3)
I�m not out to prove anything. I just pointed out this topic is more controversial then I would have imagined. As for false doctrines I could say the same about you. Can you prove pre-marital sex is fornication? I don�t think so. The Bible does not say so. If it does, prove it. You quoted 1 Corinthians 7:7-9, it says if you do not have the �Gift� it is better to marry. BTW the unmarried and widowed includes the divorced as well. Whatever the case these have all had sex before.
There are plenty of male predators out there. But the most famous is the woman on a scarlet beast, Rev 17. that is fornication and harlotry. It is not the people who wish to marry and live a normal life. Unfortunately, many believe Christianity is not normal because of these over pious and prudish teachings. It is like heaping heavy burdens, God never intended us to bear, onto the back.
Btw, it is very convenient saying the that Jewish customs do not apply here because Paul is addressing Gentile Christians. Is there any other example of marriage customs other than the Jewish wedding procession, wedding feast and the Bridegroom carrying the Bride away to the place He has prepared.
I would never be so pretentious as to say the church has a right to say who can marry whom.
