All of the issues being raised about how men and women act and treat each other right now just demonstrates the tension between the sexes that has been a result of the Fall.
Because our society has become so outspoken and so saturated in their indoctirnations in this area, we have got to carefully ask ourselves who we are believing. Yet, we are not of this world � we are told �not to be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what the will of God is, that which is good and acceptable and perfect�. (Romans 12:2). Just because times, technology, etc. has changed does not mean that God�s word and order has changed. God made them equal, both in His own image. (Gen.1 :27). He made Adam the leader, and Eve as his helpmate. (Gen.2:18)
Even from the beginning, we are seeing the establishment of God-ordained roles to the sexes. In a perfect world, (the garden of Eden) they knew the perfect balance of spiritual equality and identification / order and roles. According to the John MacArthur Study Bible, the term �one flesh� speaks of a complete unity of parts making a whole, e.g. one cluster, many grapes (Num. 13:23)� thus this marital union was complete and whole with two people.
This is a manner of design, not a statement about superiority. Every institution has to have order, structure, and organization in order to function. Think in terms of a company. There is a CEO and a CFO. There can�t be two leaders.
In this sense, they need each other. They complement each other.
Wives within a Christian marriage are given a trust by God. She is called to walk the line of submission with grace, to be selfless in her compliance, and yet productive in her contribution to the family. She is to relate to her husband as the church relates to Christ.
And what about being �weak�? I don�t think a Proverbs 31:10-31 shows a weak woman.
Proverbs 31:10-31
She is not retiring, servile, and entirely domestic. In regards to her family, it can be said that she is a manufacturer, (v.13) importer, (v.14) manager, (v.15) realtor, (v.16) farmer, (v.16) stays in shape, (v.17) philanthropist (v.20) seamstress, (19) and merchant. (v.24) (Deferent by Design, MacArthur)
In this same passage, it shows this same woman being very supportive of her man. Verse 12 � �She does him good and not evil all the days of her life.� So, the role of the woman is to support her man, not her own interests, because in the context of a Godly marriage, the focus is on Christ. They are united in living for Him, as He would have them to. In a godly marriage, why wouldn�t a woman fall in under the leadership of a man going in that direction?
But let�s be very sure to remember that the Bible has outlined what type of man this is! He is not one to take advantage of that leadership in a selfish way. The man is given an even greater trust to be the spiritual leader. By virtue of a man�s character that is able to do this, they don�t flaunt their leadership or provoke their wives or children to anger. A true leader recognizes the honor God has given him and is humble to receive it and administer that leadership with grace and care. He understands that he is under God�s rule (Eph. 5:24). He is grateful to God for the grace and love he himself has been given and loves his wife in the same manner. An honorable man tempers his authority with love, and in so doing, will find that his wife is glad to submit to his leadership. Respect is not taken, it is given, and respect that is forcefully extracted is not respect at all. Love edifies the wife�s role as helper. If more women realized how much fun it is to uplift her man, the role of submission is not drudgery. Each ordinance smoothes over the rough edges of the other. What woman would not want to respect a man that loves her? What man would not want to love a woman that respects him? As fallen men and women, we all have pride and selfish motives in relationships. Our nature does not naturally consider the interests of others above our own, male or female. Who would have thought that what goes so against our inherent thoughts and desires would be that which brings our greatest healing? The world may give us advice on relationships, resorting to its various tricks and mind games when it comes to relating to the opposite sex. There is no need. God�s plan is all spelled out. I don�t think it is an easy plan. I think it�s a delicate balance, but played out in humility it is pretty brilliant.
"...one cluster, many grapes (Num. 13:23)� thus this marital union was complete and whole with two people."
Each spouse is a separate entity with their own wants and needs and desires, yet within the Covenant of Marriage they are One and are Dependent on each other in this Covenant.
To be the "head" of a relationship actually means more that you are a "servant" of that relationship and that your spouse comes before you and that you treat them as you would treat yourself.
Everything you do no longer concerns just yourself, but rather you and your wife. You have to be always thinking of Her and how what you do will "affect" Her?
If either spouse "feels" that they "need" the other spouse...the relationship take on a "Dependency" aspect and is driven by "self" (I need...), rather than..."what does my spouse need". Make sense?
Yes. When "need" becomes a dependancy or a way to express a desire to dominate, that is our sinful nature. The negative connotation of the word "need" arises from our sinful behavior and fallen nature. On the other hand, we would agree that in another sense there is nothing unusual about a man saying they would like a woman to "need" them. You guys want to lead and be respected. It has to do with a man's ROLE in this sense, and that is how God made you! I don't hear women saying they want to be needed near as much as they want to be loved.
A woman can say she "needs" to be loved, but in our sinful nature that reeks of dependancy. If she is expressing a god-given "need" within a marriage, then it is expressing a functional balance.
Isn't it still true today, 'most' men can admit their need for a woman, yet 'most' modern women have difficulty in admitting their need of a man?
I was confused by this statement�. A �feminist�, the kind that think women should be treated BETTER than men, might paint this picture, but every unmarried woman I know besides myself is DESPERATE for a man! And yet men are the ones who don�t want to get married or to have the ol� ball and chain to put an end to their fun, even though in a lot of marriages it is the man who gets all the �perks�. I know of too many marriages where the woman really IS a servant to her husband, who takes it completely for granted. The second half of Genesis 3:16 says �And though your desire will be for your husband, he will be your master.� The Bible basically says women don�t want to be servants, but who really does in a relationship of different-but-equal? But maybe that verse is where those man-need-denial ladies are getting it from.
I agree with DontHit�s model marriage: it should be equal dedication of both to each other, just with different �roles�.
As for me, if I were to very realistically examine myself� I would probably feel that I do need a man, quite honestly. Yet I have always been super laid-back about �finding� one. I have never hunted or shopped for one, and even joining this site was just for wanting to talk on the forums! I say I probably need one because I do not have a lot of super applicable survival skills for a modern world. I spent most of my youth/adolescence/young adulthood in crippling pain, missing school and lots of life milestones to illness. Yeah, I had a summer job when I was 16, and then at 19, and then at 21, and some college experience, but I am far from a functioning adult. Looking at the job market, I would have to either finish a degree and garner some significant work experience, or settle for minimum wage. So, financially, I probably do �need� a man.
Oh, and sex would be nice, and I hear that good husbands are good for that.
But the original poster makes a good point with his choice of verses: we should neither feel in want or need for anything, because the Lord really does take care of us. I probably don�t NEED a man financially, the Lord would provide for me.
Wow!! Where to start! I guess I will start with it is so great to see that converstaion is not a dead issue:) Adding a few more cents to the pot won't hurt right?? Hehe...we all have a few we can spare.
I think that getting back to God and understanding that the Bible will lead us to the truths is where it is at in trying to find ourselves whether we are man or woman. God will provide for us no matter what gender we are, whether we are single or married. So when it comes to what either of us needs, God has and will provide the basics. Food, clothing and shelter are our basic needs and we could all just be able to live a lifetime on this earth having just that. We could believe in Him, praise Him, thank Him for that, and then we would be happy right??
I don't think that could be totally true. God made both man and woman. Yes, God created woman using the rib of Adam. That was a part of Adam, and to say that Adam doesn't need his rib, or that his rib doesn't need Adam would be bad. He did create the woman and the man different than each other, but yes, with the two joined as one in marriage, they would have what it takes to fill this earth according to one of the pieces of God's plan, and that was to multiply and fill the earth. Man and woman are two puzzle pieces that do fit together, and I believe that no matter what, either man or woman can not truthfully say that they don't need the other. We were created to fit together, to need each other. If the feeling to need each other isn't present, then part of God's plan wouldn't work right?? There would be a flaw in His plan right?? I won't believe that for a moment. To need each other, God has provided that too, which should be a part of those basic needs.
The hardest things that we have to go through is living on this earth before Heaven. It is a challenge alright! The path is narrow that leads back to Him. We are emotional beings and there is good and bad in that. As we live our life on this earth we will be constantly pulled back and forth between good and evil throughout our lifetime. The forces of evil are greater against those who appose them, that is why most people will not be saved. Because they choose to follow a society and it's rules, the people that give in to temptation, succumbing to their desires, not believing in God, they won't have to worry about anything because they make it easy for the devil to take them.
So we will be tested hard and I do not disagree with anyone on here that is trying to stir the pot to find out what another person is like in how they respond. It does show how life had led them to this point, and it definitely does not mean that they cannot change. I also believe that there are women out there that look at life like they are just trying to collect their happiness, thinking that once they have gathered together all of the things that society says are important, then their life will be the ultimate and will be truly shined upon by others. That kind of thinking does not impress God. Hopefully those women will find that out before it is too late. On the other hand there are a lot of guys out there with this macho attitude like they are going to take the Bible, mis-read it's words and treat a woman in a bad way. All this goes back to society and what they say is right. They are followers of whatever can be construed as worldly. All the experiences that we have on this earth will have good and bad, and we as christians need to sift through all of this by using the Bible to understand our purpose. We need to throw away from our life all of the feelings of hatred, disappointment, despair, dismay, anything negative from our earthly experiences. Let alone all the people who are not christians...there are so many people to choose from...let me say I will always start my search with God at my side and try and find someone who does the same. I wish you all well in your search.
I am new to the chat forums so I don't know anyone's name yet, but I saw a post that was quoting the Bible, having to do with quotes about feeling of love and respect. It reminds me of the book "Love and Respect" by Eggerichs. He is a preacher or pastor that had been a couples counselor for years before he wrote it. His travels through being a counselor took him back to the Bible to find out what we all "need" to feel. I can remember growing up as a child and through most of my life, that all that I ever was told is that the most important feeling that a man or woman could feel is the feeling of being loved. I really feel the message of this book is so true and opened my eyes. God did create us differently, both man and woman. The feeling of love is needed for both man and woman. Love is the feeling that the woman cherishes the most to feel, it makes her feel more complete than any other feeling. But the man is different. Yes, the feeling of love is very important to him, but not the most important. Respect is the one thing that he desires to feel the most out of all the feelings he could choose from. If he feels respected, then he gives love back, the woman feels loved, she gives respect back. It is a good cycle. But the opposite can happen when one of them doesn't feel loved or respected, and then the couple gets into a bad cycle where unless one of them can reciprocate a good feeling of love or respect back, the cycle will go on being bad. I think that this book is an awesome read for man or woman, single or married. We are taught by society to love and everything will be good. So it is somewhat instilled in us at an early age by society that love is all we need. I am so glad that this book had come into my life because I think that it is a good point about how relationships can be better by understanding how we were created. Just like God created man to take care of the Garden of Eden. That was a man's sole purpose designed by God. That is why a man should feel that respect is the most important to feel. But then again, he didn't have someone to give that respect to him, and he was lonely. So God created woman for that purpose and the result of their togetherness is the love desired and sought after by the woman. Each needs what they need from the other to live a happier life together.
I also believe that in our single years we should not worry so much about going after someone else to marry, that in God's timing it will all come together. But we do get caught up in our humanly needs and put more energy into trying to make that happen, but we know that we want to understand and feel God's love to the most that we can, to be able to feel that love and respect that we so desire. It is hard being human. I still have a lot of work ahead of me to understand.
